Im wondering if every signing agent lists every document that needs a notary in their journal. I list every document and the borrowers have to sign every line for every doc. too. But when I refinanced my own loan the notary who came only had my husband and I sign one line each and a thumbprint.
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If I’m not mistaken, you are in CA? I believe that’s in your workbook or the newsletter put out by your SOS - yes, you are doing it correctly - you notaries in CA must list each notarization individually using one line per notarization, get a signature for each one, and get a thumbprint for the pertinent ones.
We here in FL can list the docs on one or two lines then get one signature for all (with no thumbprint/fingerprints) here…but you are doing it correctly and that notary you had was doing it wrong. I hope that’s ALL that notary did wrong. 
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That’s not true, in Ca the buyer/borrower has to sign only one line and one thumbprint. The book has all the possible notaries and you just check the box for the docs you notarize. Its ridiculous to have them sign more than once.
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Linda is correct. California requires one line in the journal for each signature notarized. Check with the SOS’s office. It was explained to me that if someone asked for a copy of a journal entry how would you copy it if multiple documents are on the same line.
Erwin.
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Well, I’d like to agree with you Gary, but I can’t, and will not argue as I’m not in CA. All I’m going to say is if I were in CA, I’d be double checking that…from what I’ve heard from some very knowledgeable CA notaries, your SOS has published a workbook and a newsletter, both of which address this issue and it’s different from what you’re saying.
You might want to read page 4 of your 2014 newsletter then bring it up with your SOS. It was also addressed in the 2013 newsletter.
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I am in CA and according to Govt. Code Section 8206, a single line journal entry is REQUIRED for each notary act. Therefore, if you have 1 document, say a Deed of Trust, with 2 signers, that is 2 notary acts and each one must be entered individually, including the Name of the Document, Date of the Document, Date and time of Notary Act, Fee received, the location where the notary act takes place, and the I.D. information for each signer to include type of I.D., identification number, date of issue, date of expiration, name as listed on the I.D. I also include the date of birth of the signer. Then a signature and thumbprint of the signer. Making One journal entry for each signer and just checking the boxes in the journal is NOT LEGAL and will not stand up in a Court of Law. If you do this, how can you prove which notary act was performed for each document? Did you make a note that you administered an oath or affirmation for each Jurat?
This is why the signing fees need to be commensurate with the work done. $100 or less for a loan package with 15 notary acts and 2 signers is ridiculous, it should pay $300.00 for the notary acts, plus printing and travel. I spend at least 45 minutes at the signing table just to do the entries in the journal, most borrowers are astonished at the amount of work required, and I have had many who have told me that “the last notary only had us sign once”.
There are a lot of CA notaries out there that are NOT following the law, and I certainly would not want to be them when they are audited by the Secretary of State. "A notary public is guilty of a misdemeanor if the notary public willfully fails to properly maintain the notary public’s journal. (Govt. Code 8228.1) and is subject to revocation or suspension of their commission and at $2,500 fine for each infraction (notary act).
So, people, for those of you who are doing 1 journal entry for 10 documents- you are looking at $22,500 in fines and loss of your commission, plus the fines of $750.00 for failing to administer an oath or affirmation for a Jurat. So, is that $100 signing fee worth it???
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Both Callies1 and LindaH are correct, it’s amazing how many times I go to do a signing or even with GNW how people mention the last person didnt fill out that many lines/make me thumbprint, take an oath, etc… I merely explain to them it’s the law, things were expanded since the mortgage crisis, and that both, I’m not willing to cut the corner, and for their own peace of mind with fraud etc, that they are happy for the extra security. I generally dont get further resistance after that.
On the flip side, i even get documents from California agencies that are not the current acknowledgements or jurats, when i pull out my own copy customers are happy that i have the current doc and am able to provide them the copy. One customer even went as far to tell me she had wished the other notaries did the same (nearly two years after the documents changed).
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That’s correct. In California, you must have the borrower’s sign for each notarized document on a single line for each document. There is a journal available that allows you to check a box for each notarized document, but I don’t think that is approve for use by California notaries. And by the way, as of January 1, 2017, the fee for notarization has been increased to $15 per signature. I think we notaries should increase our fees to the signing services to be $15 per signature on notarized documents plus printing fees and mileage.
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Very informative. While I am not in CA, I have a general observation. Notarizing one document with two signatures would be one notarization, not two. You don’t notarize a document twice when it has two signatures. I am unfamiliar with CA journals, and you may need to list the doc twice in order to have each signer sign/thumbprint it, but notarizing the document itself is one notarial act. That said, I’m glad I’m not in CA, the amount of time just to list the documents for a purchase could add up to more time than the signing for the purchase itself! Making the comment about vastly higher pay right on target.
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For CA - their notarial act is considered notarizing per signature (and their fee structure is set up that way too) - so each notarized signature is a notarial act - so each would need to be listed in the journal individually. (according to my understanding of their law).
And I agree - I’m glad I don’t have to follow those guidelines. I don’t even need to keep a journal, but I do and list the documents I notarize along with the rest of the identifying information. Much easier
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You can increase your fees all you want but you won’t get any work. If a signing service gets $175 for a loan package, do you really think they’re going to pay you $15 each for 10 or more notarizations, in addition to paying you their normal fee for the document signing plus printing plus travel? If there is more than one signer, multiply that number of notarizations accordingly and do the math.
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You are correct LindaH. In California, the fee is $15 per signature, so if there are two signatures on the document, the fee would be $30. Follow the fee schedules set up in your state, they are not all the same. As for the journal, in California each document must be listed for each signer. This usually takes up an entire page or more for each signer!
As of July 1, WA requires Notaries Public to keep a journal. (I always have - who wouldn’t?) One would think that, having increased the time involved in the notarial act, WA legislators would then have instituted a rate increase. But no. Double the work for the same pay.
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Have you seen this? I have been using this for a month now. the best lay out ever:
easyjournal dot net
Do you have separate journals for signings and other notarizations?
I never ask signers to sign in my journal🤷‍♀️.
There is not even line for it.
Neither we have any fingerprints.
I’m in PA.
No, I only do loan signings, but on each page there is a section that you can do notarizations for forms other than loan docs.