SigningOrder.com Listing: Which RON Platform for Remote Loan Signings

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Welcome to Notary Cafe!

SigningOrder.com (and I’m on them as well) has very little if anything to do with RON. Signing Order is, simply, a website where various “signing services” post opportunities for (mostly) loan signing and GNW gigs. There are various other websites that do the same thing (Snapdocs, TCX, etc.). The true RON websites are sites like “Proof” (formerly, “Notarize”), “Blue Notary,” and “CyberizeIt.” Check them out if you’re really interested in RON.

If you continue to read our forum here, you’ll find that most of us (I’ll speak only for myself in particular) have come to distrust these loan signing services for a number or reasons, including:

  1. offering “low ball” fees for these gigs (as low as $20.00)
  2. Failing to pay the fee, once you complete the gig, within their advertised time period.

It’s important to remember that it’s the “Signing Service,” the firm that puts the gig on the website that’s responsible for paying you, not the website itself. So, in your case, SigningOrder is not responsible.

I attribute the behavior of these signing services simply to the economics of today’s times. I guess they figure they can “get away with it” and incur very little risk. Normally, fees for these types of gigs on the websites would range in the $100 - 150 area if not higher. Some Notaries with experience often earned up to $300.00 per gig with the right connections. These days, a lot of the gigs are going for as low as $20.00 up to $90.00. which often doesn’t cover the full cost of doing the gig for the Notary (when you factor in time, transportation, fuel, printing costs,etc.). To be fair, though, a lot of the lower ones are only GNW (General Notary work) of about 1-2 pages as opposed to a loan pkg of 200 pages. You have to research the gig carefully before you accept it.

The real truth to this is that these signing services are counting on young, new and inexperienced notaries to accept these “low ball” gigs without question And there are plenty of new notaries out there that will accept them. When one is hungry enough, one will take them, and the problem will continue to worsen. My earnest advice to brand new notaries would be, “don’t fall for that trap.” Don’t accept those “low ball” offers, no matter how hungry you are. It is truly a “supply and demand” thing. The signing services can’t sustain offering these low-ball gigs if the supply of notaries willing to accept them dries up to nothing. When you see an offer for $20.00, ask yourself, “what’s this gig going to cost me?” I think you’ll find it “cost prohibitive.”

That’s the first problem. The second is the failure to pay once you complete the gig. Most signing services will say they pay within a certain time period after the signing date… normally 30-45 days (best to confirm if that’s “calendar” or “business” days, first). Be careful. Some services will often delay payment by as much as 120 days, if they pay at all. Again, the economics of today’s times as well as their assessment of the “risks” of not paying. “What’s an individual Notary going to do if we don’t pay them? Will they even remember that we owe them money after 90-120 days???” Out of sight, out of mind.

To get them to pay, one must literally “harass” them into paying, Keep sending communications to remind them of the amount they owe. Step up each communication to where you threaten to use collection agencies and/or filing complaints with the title companies that gave the service the business, etc. etc. I wouldn’t take them to small claims court, though, as that’s too cost prohibitive. And all you get out of that is a judgement in your favor. But you still won’t get paid. You have to enforce that judgement on your own. The courts won’t do that.

And again, because of that “available pool” of new notaries that “don’t yet know,” the signing services aren’t worried about the supply of notaries dropping to the point where they can’t do business this way, anymore. We have to drive them to that point by just refusing the gigs. And we need your help.Choose your gigs carefully. Don’t fall for the low ball offers. Determine if the gig will be “cost beneficial” to you, after you consider all the costs of doing it. I wouldn’t do a gig for any lower than $50.00, flat minimum for GNW. I’d then try to “counter offer” for higher if I can. For loan signings, my minimum is $100.00, It’s “not worth it” for any less than that. Remember to consider the distance to the site and the time involved. Time & distance = $$$.

Anyway, I wish you well as you begin your Notary journey. Hang in there. I realize it seems bleak right now, but so is the economy. Success in the Notary business happens in “cycles.” We’re in a low one, right now, but, the high ones can be quite profitable if you hang in there.

Let us know if we can be of further help to you.

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@mag3_notary Excellent post!! So informative and true. Great advice.

The only thing I would add is my own personal SOP (standard operating procedure) - I do not accept GNW through any SS - I only do GNW very locally and I only take it through personal contact. Our GNW fees are low enough I’m not willing to give any portion of it to an SS. I restrict GNW to my own county - and visit hospitals, nursing homes, ALFs, etc with a fistful of business cards. I also have cards in our local pack and ship and they have my info to refer people to me or to call and ask for advice (which they’ve done).

I don’t do RON - BUT if you decide to do strictly RON, remember, our state allows us to charge $25 for online notarizations - and unless the referring agency is providing the clients, there would be a modest service fee as I have to maintain/provide the technology to accomplish this.

My $.02 FWIW and thank you again, @mag3_notary for your wonderful info.

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You’re quite welcome! :slightly_smiling_face:

One thing more I forgot to add. What I said above applies primarily to “mobile” notary services (where you visit the client/signer). If the signer comes to your location on their own, and a signing service is not involved (i.e. you are dealing directly with the client/signer), then that’s a much more simple transaction and usually involves a fixed fee schedule. In Florida, for example, the standard fixed fee is a maximum of $10.00 for each use of the stamp. Thus, if your signer came to you with a 6 page document and there were three different Notarial certificates for you to sign and stamp, you would charge $30.00 and no more. The only exception to this is a flat $30.00 fee for a marriage ceremony.

Now, with RON, your client does pay a bit more for a single signature/stamp (around $27.00 or so per stamp). But remember, they aren’t paying you directly. They’re paying the website platform and the platform, in turn, is paying you. But if dealing directly with the client “in person” at your location, it’s $10.00 per stamp (or $30.00 for a marriage ceremony)…

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RON fee in FL is $25.00 per notarization when dealing directly with signer. F.S. 117.275

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When you say “directly with signer,” do you mean via use of an established platform (Proof, Blue Notary etc.), or truly directly with a signer via a Zoom video conference? I haven’t done any with Proof or Blue Notary recently so their fees may have changed.

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Doesn’t matter what platform … Fee for online notarization is $25 by statute. I don’t do them at all but that’s the fee for online notarization. Nothing in the statute about charging a service fee for the technology and convenience but I would guess you could charge a modest fee for that as long as you disclose it up front with signer and they agree to it.

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Indeed it is… FS 117.275 - Fees for Online Notarization. I gather Proof and the others lowered their fee accordingly to accommodate. At one point they were charging $27.00. And I guess that would also cover a case where you dealt directly with the client by Zoom Video conference. Although, I don’t think I would do that as the advantage of the Platform is getting the ID Verify tools working and the document mark up tools as well (electronic signature/stamp etc.).

Maybe the platforms were charging $25.00 for the signing plus a ID Verify fee or the like making it $27.00. But I can see where that would “look bad” and thus reducing it to $25.00 overall, giving the Notary a little less per transaction.

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Unfortunately, that’s not what these platforms are doing … They charge the signers $35 and up and pay the notary $10-$15 … Their reasoning being they are providing the work …just like any signing service - not all platforms provide the RON provider service . most expect the notary to already have it in place (at notary’s expense) … I think Notarize is the only one…or one of the very few…who provide the platform and tech along with the clients.
Remember, in FL, before your RON commission is issued you have to have an approved RON provider in p!ace and let the SOS know who that is. Again, in the statute.

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Thank you for taking the time to answer my post. You not only answered my question but answered questions I didn’t know I had yet. I am very much trying to build this business slowly and the RIGHT way. Without “undercutting” myself along the way.

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Blue Notary is another. But that whole “providing the client” thing is a myth (effectively).

While both Proof (Notarize) and Blue Notary offer clients, it’s almost impossible for the average Notary to catch them. Not unless you live very close to the servers that dispense the alerts for those platforms. The server for Proof/Notarize is in Boston, MA. And the server for Blue Notary is in Chicago. When they send an alert over the Internet, it may take some latency milliseconds for the alert to reach people not in the general proximity of those servers (that would be us, here in FL). By the time you see the alert or hear the alert tone (which only Proof provides… Blue Notary’s alerts are silent), and you click to accept the client, that client is long gone… already taken. And that’s not even counting the extra “seconds” it takes for you to see the alert, get your mouse over to the accept button and click it. Even more time is taken with Blue Notary as there is no alert tone. You might be somewhere else on the screen and never know it happened until you bring that tab into focus and see the alert. But, of course, by then it’s way too late.

Additionally, a lot of “hacker” Notaries have written some “Auto response” software that responds to the alert immediately And that may help a little… with the micro seconds after the alert is received on your machine. But the alert still has to get to your machine for the auto responser software to work. Now, Proof has stated they officially condemn this practice of auto responders and will terminate anyone’s account if they are caught using one. The problem being, it’s a bit hard to catch them.

The RON platforms want you to “BYOC” bring your own clients. It;s what makes them grow, faster.

I have both Proof(Notarize) and Blue Notary on file with the SOS and always have. And every time I change my platform list (one way or another), I have to send in that form to the DOS.

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Hello ~ you and Linda stated a lot of good points. Important thing to include is what state you are located. Linda is a seasoned person and knows her rates. I’m in WA State where I go by state rates and state that information on my flyers and Google page. Have been doing more GNW lately and people find my simplistic Google page helpful Also printed laminated copies of page for full care facilities, hospitals, etc. This is just my part time job because I’m retired. I do stay busy and have a lot of call backs. I relate good to seniors but also provide other professional services.

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As am I. I also do some side gigs as an on-line tutor, teaching Math, English and Computer skills while building the Notary business and networking, building relationships. In these times, it does pay to diversify.

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Yes, I have already submitted to my state for Blue Notary and Notarize (Proof). After 3, actually 4 months now w/BN I have definitely grown tired and cancelled my “hybrid” subscription with them. I was able to catch only 2 through BN. Very discouraging. I am going through the training now w/Notarize. Hoping that will bring me a little more work along w/practice of RON work. In the meantime, I guess I will just keep studying my little brain away and start marketing more locally for direct signings.

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I LOVE IT! I’m in Florida and have been wanting to start this career for awhile. Its part time also. I work full time from Home doing Customer Service. But Have 2 months off d/t a hip replacement. I’m hoping to show my other half how much I can grow my “side business” in that time. My hopes are to eventually have it replace my full time job, but time will tell. I love the flyer idea. Working on some marketing stuff as well for local nursing homes, hospitals, ect.

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To be fair, I have actually been able to catch a couple of “witness” gigs on Blue Notary (where I acted as one of the witnesses). But they only pay half of the Notary Pay. Blue Notary pays $10.00 for the first stamp to the Notary unless you bring the client to the platform. Then it’s a bit more (minus the fee for the ID-Identify service).

You might be able to catch some Notary gigs if you are on the system at times when most of the other Notaries are not. But it’s hard to know when those times are. Also, you might catch them at the “month end” crunch if there is much of one, and the demand is higher.

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You did everything but answer the question…
She asked what signing platform to use, and which is accepted with most signing companies?

Bill

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Actually, I did. Look at the very first paragraph.

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Clear Sign, I have been using it for 2. 1/2 years, it has been my experience If you become a notary with a title company they have the platform that you use. It is nothing that you go out and buy unless you’re doing signing on your own, platform most companies have they own

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Thank you. I’ll look into ClearSign. it is a little confusing with all the platforms and fees. esp when you are just learning. Im registered w/Notary Live and Blue Notary & I just finally got approved on Notarize. So I am trying that out for RON. I am also looking into ONENotary. But I have seen some job posts come over on SigningOrder.com and the post reads as : RON: Seller Package. So I could have grabbed it, a few times, but I was too nervous too, because I didn’t know what would happen next. I feel confident in my knowledge and the docs, its really just the initial process that is keeping me from getting to the next step or from grabbing my first RON closing.

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