Here’s my situation, and I’m completely open to input. I did a power of attorney with a middle person organizing it. The principal was an elderly lady and she easily proved competent. I collected IDs from everyone and recorded them as normal. The agents were a son and a grandson having the same name, both named Danny. I thought everything was fine, though the ordeal was a little chaotic.
2 days later, the organizer informs me the PoA had to be redone.
The issue was that at some point, when the organizer was writing in the information, she took it upon herself to write in “Sr.” for the elder Danny in the informational section at the start. The place where it was being used decided not to allow it. I did not write this myself anywhere, it was also not on his ID, so it was not that I missed it; she never should have added it.
There was an Attorney-in-fact acceptance form. I had the AIF print his name in the blank and notarized it.
The organizer wanted a refund for the issue. I am of the mind that if I make a mistake, I will own it and fix it at no charge. But I felt no mistake was made on my part, and I was not willing to refund.
I let her know that she wrote that, not me. I also informed her that a notary’s job is not to proofread the document for errors in its body.
I know we are to make sure the signatures are of the individuals listed at the signing lines, which they were, and to ensure that there are no blank lines to leave things possible to be changed after the fact.
She had the audacity to tell me that everyone, including the notary who did the follow-up, said I was at fault. Was I?
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Imo no, you were not…the middleman, by her own admission, was at fault. I would not refund and I would also ask why she is taking the word of the “follow-up” notary. IMO she just doesn’t want to suck up two notary fees.
Not sure where you are, but here in FL and in my last life in CT, unless I am notarizing the signature of the proposed agent, I do not check their IDs. However, I DO confirm with the principal that they know these agent(s) and wish them to be their AIF. And I DO record witnesses’ names in my journal.
Good Luck with this. Hope this is resolved properly. Keep us posted and p!ease let us know who this" organizer" is. People like this is why I don’t take GNW appointments from third parties or middlemen.
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I’m in FL too. I did all that with the witnesses and stuff, just didn’t wanna bloat the scenario. But 100% cuz especially PoA, I never wanna not have proper record. Too much chance for getting pulled into a fraudulent notary on those as it is. The organiser wasn’t an official company as far as I know, maybe someone just getting started.
As far as resolved, I refused her a refund and told her that her accusation would never hold in court, just want to check with the community and make sure I wasn’t wrong after all. Thank you for taking the time to reply.
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Not your mistake. Thing is, guys are not born/named “Sr.”…it only occurs when a “Jr.” gets so named. So, Sr. may or may not be used by the Dad, but Jr. is part of the son’s name.
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In this case, she decided on her own, which she admitted because they had the same name. I told her I took no blame for what she chose to do.
No, I agree, you are definitely not to blame. I am sorry you had to go through this experience and hear feedback putting the blame on you.
Question, There was an Attorney-in-fact acceptance form. I had the AIF print his name in the blank and notarized it.
Why?
Your propose was to notarize the signature of the principal. One signature POA $10 plus travel fee.
How did you notarize the agent’s signatures? Was there an embedded acknowledgment in the document for that purpose or did you add his name to the principal’s acknowledgment?
Joe, some Florida POA forms have an AIF acceptance section. Been a while since I did one so don’t recall of it is notarized or not.
Good point here though…as a point of reference, this came from a third party…it is my understanding that POA laws have changed in FL in the past 2-3 years. This middleman may have not used proper FL compliant forms.
State specific, I suppose. I Googled it and came up with an affidavit of agent that is signed by the agent and notarized.
POA has eight pages, including a whole page dedicated to witnesses’ signatures. I’m guessing this was designed to protect old people from being swindled out of everything by an unscrupulous agent.
PoA has no single look or style, like any form; they vary by who creates them. I’ve seen typed and fill-in-the-blank; this was a fill-in packet. On the acceptance page, there was a line to print his name and then sign it. I never fill in anything for anyone. In most cases, the AIF acceptance page has a notary section. I would never add to a notary block a name that didn’t belong; that would be doing the job improperly, and I would never risk that. I do everything in my power not to be the cause of errors.
California has a UniformStatutory Form Power of Attorney
(California Probate Code Section 4401)
NOTICE: THE POWERS GRANTED BY THIS DOCUMENT ARE BROAD AND SWEEPING. THEY ARE
EXPLAINED IN THE UNIFORM STATUTORY FORM POWER OF ATTORNEY ACT (CALIFORNIA PROBATE
CODE SECTIONS 4400–4465). THE POWERS LISTED IN THIS DOCUMENT DO NOT INCLUDE ALL POWERS
THAT ARE AVAILABLE UNDER THE PROBATE CODE. ADDITIONAL POWERS AVAILABLE UNDER THE
PROBATE CODE MAY BE ADDED BY SPECIFICALLY LISTING THEM UNDER THE SPECIAL INSTRUCTIONS
SECTION OF THIS DOCUMENT. IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THESE POWERS, OBTAIN
COMPETENT LEGAL ADVICE. THIS DOCUMENT DOES NOT AUTHORIZE ANYONE TO MAKE MEDICAL AND
OTHER HEALTHCARE DECISIONS FOR YOU. YOU MAY REVOKE THIS POWER OF ATTORNEY IF YOU
LATER WISH TO DO SO.
The top of our POA contains this disclosure
In California I’ve seen POA forms pulled off the Internet and used by my signers. Some of them have a checklist granting all the powers or letting the Grantor determine which powers are given to the Grantee. I haven’t had a page where the Grantee’s signature is notarized. In Trust signings there are special documents such as the Advanced Health Care Directive which are used for medical decisions. If the signer doesn’t have an AHCD in place, the hospital or care center will usually provide their version for the patient before the stay or procedure.
