$100 for 100 miles… When you calculate your gas for the round trip(s), paper and printing cost, it comes down to how you value your time. It sounds like this was at least a 6 hour day, probably more. IMHO that should have been at least a $225 job.
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If there’s only one buyer and the wife is on the mortgage because she lives in the house than there’s only going to be one name on the 4506…
Doesn’t matter that they file jointly… the 4506 is a request for previous tax returns from the buyer whose trying to do a refi.
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Mistakes will happen, what will make or break you is how you handle it. Sometimes you know in your heart that it wasn’t your error, or you were given no instructions how to handle a situation. Trying to reach anyone after hours or on the weekend can be a challenge so we just make a decision and go forward.
When getting heat for an error the best thing is to ask for a copy of the document so that you can remedy the situation. I sometimes suspect that documents get stuck in a scanner at the receiving end, or someone has spilled their coffee, but sometimes we need to take one for the team.
My reaction to getting a ‘you messed up’ message, is apologizing and asking what can I do to fix it. Once I have received the document I compare it to the scan, if one was requested. If I do not have a scan I look at the original signing packet. I keep them on my computer for three days in case of blowback. Sometimes ‘missing’ documents were not part of the original packet. In this case I think it is fair to ask for more money for the trip to get those documents signed.
We are all just trying to do the best we can, I think a little kindness goes a long way, we are here for the long haul and building relationships is key to being successful.
J
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The fee is definitely too low. Look at your cost for printing and paper and then the cost for gas and what you can write off. Then add whatever profit you want to make. Also, look at what others are charging in your area. If you’re charging way too much you’re not going to get any work. It’s unfortunate that people will take low-paying jobs, but you need to work or at least I do.
If I make a mistake, I just say I’ll take care of it. And then I do. There’s no sense in arguing especially if it’s my fault, if it’s theirs then we’ll talk. Don’t get defensive, don’t argue, just agree on something and get it done. I’ve had issues with many signing agencies, and even a title company or two, but the customer comes first and their loans need to fund. And, don’t forget, you can be sued.
You can get past issues and get it done and come out better for it and continue the relationship. Fly by night companies that do not care about respect or trust aren’t companies you want to work for long term. You may catch a job with one or two here and there, but they’re not going to be your bread and butter.
I find that with companies that I do a lot of work for, if I make a mistake they know I’ll take care of it and they don’t care because they know it’s going to happen sometimes. And, they don’t haggle with me on fees because they know I’m going to get it done no matter what.
I learned the hard way to give them exactly what they want nothing more and nothing less. The 4506 is a tricky one if both are on the note they may be both on one or have separate ones. If one party isn’t on the note they usually won’t have them sign the 4506.
One of the things I tell them is if it doesn’t say date don’t date it, because I’ve had to go back for that as well.
The biggest issue that I have come across is on purchases especially out-of-state ones. They wait till the last minute and then expect you to do the impossible. My first question is always, when do they need documents back. Because if they’re scheduling this after the cut off, then how the hell am I going to get the documents back the next day? Yes, they have clueless people that work at the title company and you’re basically doing their job for them, but it will save you so much grief to just find out ahead of time and make sure there are no problems. It also doesn’t hurt to ask with seller’s closings as well.
Anyone can have a bad day. I once forgot my glasses and missed initials and I basically told them don’t worry about it. Don’t pay me because this was a long-time customer and I totally screwed up. I wasn’t able to go fix it. You can write something like that off. And trust me, you’re not likely to do it again. That particular Company still gives me at least $1,000 a month worth of work every month. Just do the best you can, apologize if you screw up and fix it.
I hope this helps a little. Good luck.
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First. I would not have taken it with the low fee, long trip and the extra requirement to take it to the title company with the extra time and mileage to do that. It sounds like the title company or lender was once more pushing signing to the last possible second. Then in their panic, they make you responsible. Sounds like theyr mess stopped with you. We all miss signatures or initials occasionally. But i do a run through of all pages before i leave. Saves regret later. Never question the docs they give you. Your job is to present them and notorize. If tge signer questions things and you cannot get on touch with the title company or lender, they have the option to stop.
I am also a real estate agent (mostly retired) for 37 years, so im pretty aware of what belongs. Also, if lender or title co mess up (wait till last minute) then i have seen lender eat points to get the rate back. Lesson learned. One note though, not your loan. Dont get emotionally involved. I just ask how they think i can solve the problem. Scan everything.
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That’s a great idea about the slash; easy, makes it unambiguous.
True. In this case, both spouses were the buyers.
Yeah, that’s weird, every lender has their own quirks, when your doing your prep work and you see something that doesn’t make sense to you, stop, and make the phone call…saves a lot of time and frustration… Now that signing is yesterday’s news, you learned from your mistake and it’s on to the next one…
Good luck in your endeavors.
Dennis
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I only have the person whose name is printed on the 4506C sign, but if in doubt I just give the lender 2 options, 1 & 2, I put a yellow sticky note option #1 on the doc signed by the person printed on the doc and a yellow note option #2 on one signed by both spouses. Then the lender can choose which one they need! That’s another reason to make printed copies for the signers so you can use their extra copies for fixing mistakes or adding additional signing options 1 & 2! Good luck! 
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Did they send you a copy of the page(s) with your mistake. In other words, if you missed an initial, a photocopy of the page should have been emailed to you. This would not hold up funding causing extra pages. Or hold up funding in any event. As for the 4506-C, Is the wife on the Note? If so there should have either had a 4506-C for her or she should have been on the one for the husband. Typically there are two when there are 2 borrowers. HOWEVER, if she was not on the Note as a signer she should not have signed at all. They would have no reason or right to see her tax returns. As for holding up funding they could have sent a copy directly to the borrower and it could have been signed correctly. Whatever that is. You always need to read the top of the 4506-C to see whose name is on it. That is who signs. As for the extra pages. Somebody is pulling you leg. Probably because of your mistake? LOL. The correction agreement would also have covered the missing initial. If in fact it was missing. As for the Covid, that changes everything. Do it by mail. They could have done it by mail. There is the recision period. This is just too weird. They are just giving you a hard time. BUT having said all of that you still need to get paid. So I hope get this resolved. Quite frankly, 100 miles at today’s gas prices, you would will be at a loss the minute you get in your car for the second time. What I think is: They are unreasonable. Those extra pages still bother me. And the Covid situation makes this ridiculous. What I would do: show you copies of your mistake(s). If they are valid and you want to end this tell Title or whoever they are to send the docs email to them (or you send them.) And you will pay the Fedex (or UPS) back to them. Hopefully you have an account. Tell them you are not walking into a Covid situation. (Let them deduct $20). You’d be showing more good faith than they are showing. It would be cheaper for you, that’s for sure. But make them show you the mistake. Good Luck.
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FWIW…shipping delays often happen when there is bad weather on the East Coast. So the weather in Southern California has nothing to do with it.
Did they have the scanbacks or the original docs?
Correct! They are being selfish, ignorant, and abusive!
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You may be right; I acknowledged that in my comments.
Great advice about providing options…I’ve done that with other docs that were questionable, apparently I had too much confidence in my opinion this time.
This goes in my bag of tricks, thanks!
Good questions: No, they didn’t send a copy. I wish they had done so, and I wish I had scanned everything as a personal protocol. It only takes a couple minutes.
Yes the wife is on the Note, and signed everything else as well.
Correction agreement: that sounds like something that *should exist…maybe I just didn’t know where to look.
As far as taking the job for $100: the initial offer didn’t mention doing a dropoff at their office, so I assumed they’d send a fedex label. That would’ve been about 70 miles r/t. Then I found out they wanted a dropoff, and asked them to reassign, then realized I’d previously dropped at that office and thought maybe it’d be good to show a face periodically. Of course I just ended up dropping it with an unknown person, who then had it sent to the actual writing office, so no benefit there. In other words, I led myself down the path. Of course the 2nd signing also required the additional dropoff trip, which just made the whole job even more of a kerfuffle.
I guess I will try to look at it all as paying tuition.
Thanks for your thoughts!
Paying tuition. . . that’s a great way of looking at the learning curve in this job. I really like that.
We all have at least one story where we have been hung out to dry for some reason that defies reason. Sorry you had to go through this. But it’s overkill (I think anyhow but not my call) to scan every package to keep your customers honest. Time is money. They should be expected to send you a photocopy of the error. Any reputable company would do that. And until they did I would not do anything for them. As for the extra pages, that is nonsense. At the very least they should split the fee with you. I don’t know who this company is but they are certainly not trustworthy. That is putting it nicely.
Hopefully your upcoming jobs will help make up for this debacle. I wish that for you.
Just another thought, I can’t imagine why they would be upset that the wife signed. She should sign the 4506-C. This whole thing is weird. The correction agreement is sometimes called a limited power of attorney. It allows the lender or title company (depending who provides the document) to make corrections that are typograpical or clerical in nature. (Street is written as Avenue. Zip codes. even a missing initial if that is missing and does not affect the loan itself.) I apologize if I am telling you something you know already. Have a good day.
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In the first place I wouldn’t ever charge less than $150 on a refinance. I seem to have to scan to most companies. If I were to have to go back I would feel my fee was covering it.
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I agree $100 for 100 miles is a ridiculous fee
I was taught I had to make $50/hour out here to be profitable… before gas went up…
Initials line on pages?
PAY ATTENTION they need to be initialed
2 people listed on that doc means 2 sets of initials
tell them to leave room for each other…
CONTROL THE TABLE
4506
one name printed one name signs… period.
2 nd name name missing THEIR FAULT NOT YOURS
…DO NOT ASSUME THE SPOUSE SIGNS EVER.
U can ask title or escrow
OR signing Company
on SNAPDOCS PUT IT IN NOTES NOBODY ANSWERS…ITS ON THEM
Additional DOCS because you made mistakes?
on you
I hope u had the signers sign in front of you on that recycle bin…
and I hope you are well
I am not afraid to call and ask any question…dont be in the future
NEVER ASSUME
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