Received this email from a title/signing service regarding a loan package I performed last week. "Hello,
Can you please provide an APA for the above file, please see the details of the closing/request below. The mortgage was rejected due to the acknowledgement not meeting the requirements for Massachusetts.
Key Information About the APA Request:
• Document APA is required for: Mortgage
• Signers:
• Date of Signing: 1//2025
• Error or Correction: Acknowledgement does not meet standards for recording state.
We only need a scan of the APA requested as this file is being erecorded."
I had to attached a Florida loose Acknowledgment certificate to notarize the mortgage document. The Massachusetts Acknowledgment does not comply with Florida statute section 117.05(13)(a). Last week, I spoke with the company and got permission to attach the loose certificate. So I was surprised to get this email request. This is not the first time that I been asked to do illegal notarial acts by title companies or signing services over the years. If this happens to someone with ten years of loan signing experience, imagine what could happen to a new Loan Signing Agent.
Update:
"I received your voicemail, and I am having technically issues with my phone this afternoon. I did not want this to go unanswered. I am trying to determine how to move forward as the acknowledge provided for the mortgage does not meet the requirements for recording. Per the county: Acknowledgement does not conform to Massachusetts statute. The state has specific verbiage required to be stated to be accepted.
I will need to confirm with our signing services team how to proceed, I am not as knowledgeable with cross border signings.
Thank you"
In this feedback: The representative omits not being familiar with “cross border signings”. Most time these types of situation occur with lenders, title companies, and signing services that are nationwide operations. As we all know each state has their own satutures for their notaries/loan signing agents must adhere too.
What I do know, there were no “error” or “correction” needed to be done on my part in this process.
And never ever fall for the guilt-trip “well, everyone else does it - no one ever refused before”.
In @cfletcher’s case, (a) in FL we need the original doc back and a revisit to the signer; and (b) there IS an agreement among states to accept other state’s notarizations.
I imagine one objection cfletcher has to this request is sending an acknowledgement that isn’t attached to, or at least in the same envelope as, the original document. An additional objection might be trying to correct an acknowledgement after the notary appointment is finished.
I have heard that Massachusetts requires, even if the acknowledgement is taken out of state, that the certificate say that the signer made the acknowledgement voluntarily. I’m linking a memo that might back this up. If you met with the signers and had a do-over, maybe adding the word “voluntarily” to your certificate would solve the problem.
LindaH-FL, Exactly! That’s is why I provided details and facts to support my position. I am willing to work with the companies to do whatever is legal to complete the loan signing process. I do not make “free” second trips for mistakes made by lenders, title companies, or signing services.
I read that memo you provided, it seems Massachusetts gives their notaries leeway to do certain things to various documents. A lot of times the lender/title company stated “do not alter documents”, this was one of those situations. My only option was to use a FL loose acknowledgment notarial certificate and staple it to the mortgage document. It’s my practice to never add any verbiage to the documents. I usually ask that the lender or title companies to revise their own documents. With the lender or title company approval, I will strike-out the state, county, date, or signer’s name to make corrections in the notary block.
I might agree, depending on what you mean. I’d not add verbiage outside the notary block; if that needs to be done, let the signer do it.
I’d only make simple changes to a provided notarial certificate, such as striking out and replacing a incorrect state in the venue.
If I have to add a loose certificate, it’s been my practice since Vermont passed RULONA to choose one of the short form certificates provided in the law. But I believe I have authority to modify the certificate to fit the situation, if necessary. I’d rather not, because it’s tricky to get it right.
A couple of years ago, a lender email stating that I didn’t stamp a mortgage that had already been filed at the court house and needed me to drive over an hour one way, redo the mortgage and acknowledgement, date it for the date of original signing and scan it back. I told them it’s illegal and would not do that. She proceeded to loop in another person and ask them to inform me of how a notarization works. EXCUSE ME? I reiterated that it was illegal and refused again. I did offer to drive to the court house of filing and place my stamp if it was in fact missing. Crickets after that.
That situation has always stuck with me and I have asked around. The court house would not file the mortgage if the stamp was missing. Since it was already filed, the stamp was clearly not missing. Sounds pretty scammish to me!!
Thank you for sharing your experience. FYI, it’s a good thing those people did not take you up on your offer and you properly was not serious about - “I did offer to drive to the court house of filing and place my stamp if it was in fact missing.” In Florida, we can not place our stamp on any document without the signer being present. We all learn from those types of experiences.
I absolutely was not going to stamp that document. I was just going to look at it to verify the validity of their request. Since I never heard back, it was obviously a scam of some kind.
From what I’ve heard from Vermont town clerks, some of them don’t believe their authorized to reject anything that someone presents for recording. Just because it’s recorded doesn’t guarantee it will hold up if it gets challenged in some sort of trial.
Agreed. California is real STRICT about our forms. Out of state certs get a diagonal line through it with “Please See Attached” written on that line. A California acknowledgment is then attached. Our seal is ONLY used on Cal acks or Cal jurats. They are a pair.
In California, they permit revisions but not amendments, hence it is crucial to ensure that your notarizations are error-free. The majority of my loan signing customers are finalizing deals on properties located outside of California. It is imperative that you do not, under any circumstances, substitute the acknowledgment on the out-of-state deed with one that complies with California standards. Should you make this error, the document will be rejected by the county clerk, and you may be asked to engage in unlawful activities to rectify it. The failure to record the deed is a significant issue, and you may not receive this unfortunate news for several weeks.
