My notary work is my only source of income and I do not deduct my fees from anything. My state does regulate notary fees. My taxes are prepared by a very competent CPA. I do not pay self-employment tax.
The self-employment tax is assuming you donât have a W-2 job. I donât, I just have my businesses, so I pay taxes quarterly. I also pay myself a salary as an s-corp, so the remaining profit from the businesses is subject to self-employment tax.
However, I get to deduct all income received from notarial acts which lowers that figure substantially.
The Washington administrative code cited by Tisno only mentions notarial acts. I read it, and saw no mention whatsoever of âstampâ, âsealâ, or âcertificateâ. This section of the code absolutely does not support the notion that notary fees are based on the number of stamps.
So, if a notary is not signing (as in witnessing), and/or appending a stamp as in administering an oath, certifying, etc., what other activity would the notary be doing? And without one or both of those two items (signature/stamp) what other evidence is there that a notary was part of the transaction?
To my read, the question was about whether the $10 fee is for (each) signature (I assume signing party) or per stamp. And, of course that depends on how the acknowledgement is worded. If worded as:
. . .before me appeared Jane Doe and John Doe who provided evidence of identity. . ., the notary will append a single signature and stamp. But, if each party had a single, individual acknowledgement, then of course that would be two notarial acts. What am I missing?
The question would be do I charge $20 in that case or just 10 even though I acknowledged 2 people signatures but with 1 stamp and my signature? And you actually brought up a new thought, the Notary acknowledgment for identifying purpose with the notarial wording verses the signer acknowledging the contents of the document.
On loan docs the Notary commonly signs and stamps for 2 signers on one certificate no matter if it is an acknowledgment, Jurat or for identifying purposes.
Thank you for this info as well!
You charge $10. You only performed one notarial act, even though two people signed. A way to look at it is that your signature/stamp is both your receipt of service and your invoice. You only performed a single transaction. That would become evident if you did independent RON notary work. You are charged for each notary seal appended to the form. I am a WA state notary as well. For a certifying or different read on this, I suggest you ask the SOS.
Thank you so much. I have only charged per stamp myself and then I started questioning if I was doing it wrong due to the wording. I want to make sure Iâm not shorting myself as well as doing things legally since this IS stipulated in Wa state.
I will respond to Tisinoâs comment sentence by sentence.
So, if a notary is not signing (as in witnessing), and/or appending a stamp as in administering an oath, certifying, etc., what other activity would the notary be doing?
The notary is speaking and listening to the person who appeared.
Notary: âMr. Jones, is that your signature on this paper, and did you sign it as your own act for the purpose stated in the document?â
Mr. Jones: âYes.â
Thatâs an acknowledgement, which is one notarial act.
Notary: âMrs. Jones, is that your signature on this paper, and did you sign it as your own act for the purpose stated in the document?â
Mrs. Jones: âYes.â
Thatâs a second acknowledgement, and a second notarial act.
But the notary isnât finished. Although the notarial acts have occurred, they must be properly written down.
- So in every state, the notary must write out an acknowledgement certificate. In this case, the acknowledgement certificate would have, in the space for the signerâs names, âJohn Jones and Mary Jonesâ.
- In every state, the notary must sign the acknowledgement certificate.
- In many states the notary must stamp the acknowledgement certificate.
- In many states, the notary must make sure the acknowledgement certificate is attached to the document.
- In every state, the acknowledgement certificate stays with the document, not with the notary
- In many states, the notary must write out a journal entry. In some states, there would have to be two journal entries, one for Mr Jones and one for Mrs Jones.
And without one or both of those two items (signature/stamp) what other evidence is there that a notary was part of the transaction?
True, without an acknowledgement certificate or a jurat, there would be no permanent evidence that the notary took some acknowledgements or administered some oaths. But the notarial acts occur first, and the creation of certificates comes a minute or two later. The certificate is not the notarial act; the spoken exchange is the notarial act. The certificate is a permanent record of the spoken exchange.
Strictly speaking, you didnât acknowledge 2 peopleâs signatures. Each of the 2 people acknowledged each of their signatures. You listened to them. If they just sat there and didnât say anything, you would ask them if the signatures on the paper are theirs, and if they signed as their own act for the purpose stated in the document. They would say âyesâ. Each time one of them says âyesâ, thatâs the acknowledgement.
Listening to a signer acknowledge his or her signature is called âtaking an acknowledgementâ.
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For another example of a notarial act, consider a purely oral oath. A notary administers an oath to tell the truth to someone who is about to give oral testimony. Nothing is written, itâs all oral. But administering the oath was definitely a notarial act.
I would not write off notary fees without the advice of a lawyer or CPA. The differences in the responses to this post indicates more than one interpretation of what constitutes a notarial act I have been using Notary Gadget which calculates the portion of the fee which you can write off on your taxes but the notary still has to calculate the number of notarial acts for the software to determine the amount of the deduction.
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I agree with getting professional advice about how to calculate notary fees. State laws are all different. The state doesnât have to base the notary fees on the number of notarial acts; they can write the fee law, if there is one, any way they want. And states donât have to define notarial act the same way RULONA does.
I used to be a volunteer firefigher in New York State. The state decided they didnât want to make fire departments get registration plates for fire trucks, so in the part of the law about registrations, they created a definition that said a fire truck was not a motor vehicle. Definitions in laws donât have to make sense.
The Notary Guidelines for the state of WA says nothing about âspeech and listeningâ. This is the exact language of the notarial act:
Perform the notarial duty
Alongside recording the notarial act, it is important that you perform the duty that is being asked of you by the signing party and identified by the notarial certificate. The requirements for each of these duties are slightly different and are discussed below in more detail.
Complete the notarial certificate
An essential element to performing a notarial act is completing the notarial certificate, where your signature and seal will be placed. The certificate contains your verification of the act being witnessed. It may be a separate document, or it may be a section on an existing document.
***Each certificate has a few required components that must be present; the minimum language is provided in state law, but the actual language may vary from document to document. As long as you can identify all four components in the notarial certificate, the language in the statement of particulars can vary from the language provided by state law. The components required for a notarial certificate include:
****Venue: the state and county where the notarial act was performed.
⢠âStatement of particularsâ: the statement of which notarial act is being performed, which must include who the signing party is, when they are signing, and what they are specifically attesting to. For example, the statement of particulars for an acknowledgement may say, âThis record was acknowledged before me on (date) by (name of signing party).â Notaryâs Signature: there should be a space designated for your signature.
⢠Notaryâs Stamp: there should also be a space designated for your seal or stamp.
So the notarial act boils down to filling in the requisite information in the acknowledgement/jurat, signing and stamping. At a maximum cost of $10 per notarial act; not $40 for asking each party the same question, listening to their response, and considering the signature and stamp two independent acts of notarization. But, good for those who live in states where doing general notary work appears to be more lucrative.
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OK, the Washington State Notary Public Guide uses the language
The notarial act consists of three parts: recording the act in a notarial journal, performing the notarial duty, and completing the notarial certificate. [page 11]
But the Washington notary law uses the RULONA wording I quoted before when it comes to defining an acknowledgement, notarial act, and verification upon oath or affirmation. So the notary guide is using different definitions than the law, at least on page 11.
The fees Washington notaries are not spelled out in the law, they are in the Washington Administrative code (WAC). The section on definitions says the definitions for the WAC are the same as for the notary law. That definitions section does not define âacknowledgementâ, ânotarial actâ, or " verification on oath or affirmation" so they would be defined the same as in the law.
The WAC section about fees pretty much agrees with page 50 of the notary guide. It looks to me like the guide is using different definitions on different pages.
You can or cannot pay - but if you donât it can be detrimental to you as SE taxes are the equivalent of the employer/employee SS/Medicare deductions. If you donât pay them itâs possibly because your deductions cancel out your tax liability.
Regardless of how many sources of income you have - your notary income is taxable on a federal level - the only exemption on your notary fee is SE taxes.
P.S. Iâve heard of many notaries who had "very competentâ CPAs who ended up getting audited because the CPA had no clue how to handle notary income and exemptions.
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Iâll add that I was an observer on the committee that created RULONA. Iâm linking to my dropbox that has a copy of the 2010 roster; see page 4.
It varies by state, in Nevada, we charge per signature.