Hi. Fairly new to these forums. Hope I contribute well and can offer some advice as well as get some.
My question involves how far you as a Notary would go to “enforce” payment from a Signing Service that refuses to pay or is late in doing so. Currently, I have an active case going on with one such service (Notaroo). I’ve done two signings with them. One on 05/30/2023 and the other on 06/13/2023. The first signing was offered at $170.00 (it was a HECM reverse mortgage) and the other, a loan application for $90.00. As has been noted by many on this forum, they advised they pay “45 days after the signing date.”
Well, it’s been over 60 days for the first and almost 50 days for the 2nd. And I’ve not been paid for either, so far. I feel like I wan to “turn up the heat” on them. Which brings me to the title of this thread… “How far would you go?”
Would you be willing to go as far as filing a “small claims court” action against them, if it were worth doing so (i.e. if you were able to recover court costs, fees, processor fees etc.) along with the principal amt? Would you file complaints against the company with their professional affiliates (Notaroo is a member of the NRMLA - National Reverse Mortgage Loan Assoc). Or file with the Atty General’s office? Or advise the title company associated with the assignment?
I ask, because I’d want to be aware of the risks involved in doing so. Particularly, the risk of being “black balled” by the company for enforcing payment for what I was owed in the first place. Am I taking a risk that they’ll notify the other services to “avoid using this Notary” if I take action against them? Furthermore, if one files a small claims action against them, the judge may only enter a judgement against the company. It doesn’t mean they will enforce payment. You still have to do that, yourself.
If it were a small amount ($20.00 fee, for example), I’d just write it off and be done with it. But $260.00 in total is a large amount to just “write off.” and to let them “get away” with not paying. But, again, how far would you go to “enforce payment?” And what are the risks of doing so?
In all honesty - it all depends on the terms you agreed to when you signed up with them. What were their payment terms, which should have been disclosed prior to contracting with you, either at time of signup or in your job confirmation.
If none, and you didn’t sign any agreement (or, even if you did, IMO) NOW is the time to say “enough is enough” and get your demand letters out. They are a platform - not sure how responsible they are for your payment. I’d contact title on each assignment and let them know now that you’ve not been paid.
Before you demand payment though - check the property records for the signings you did - make sure that the security instrument YOU notarized was recorded - that’s your proof that the loan has funded
I would contact the Title Co. involved and request they give hiring party a nudge. And, I’d contact hiring party with the same e-mail. As you said, filing a small claim gets you a judgement…you still have to do the collecting. imho, you’d be throwing good money after bad.
Thank you. The loan has been funded (I verified that already). The 2nd was only a loan application.
Yes, the “platform” is not responsible for payment (in this case, Signing Order). The signing service (in this case, Notaroo) is. I have already sent the first “demand” letter. No response. I get the impression that this company is a “pro” when it comes to “not paying” notaries and dealing with the potential risks… (i.e. “What are they going to do?”)… Well, there are things I can do… but at what risk to myself? Can they “black ball” me with the other signing services? Especially if I file public complaints or write negative Yelp/Google Reviews? I don’t know. I have to decide it it’s truly worth trying to collect, or should I just write it off, as much as it is.
What state are you in? I have filed small claims a few times when I practiced in California. I was also successful with collecting on the judgments. It helps if you can find someone that has received payment from them to get their checking and routing number off of their checks (even E-checks). This will allow you to levy their bank account. Yes, you can recoup the filing and process serving fees.
Writing the debt just encourages them to use other notaries. I wouldn’t worry about black balling, you will always have good references if needed. Good Luck!
Small claims works only if the company is in your jurisdiction. Filing a small clams case on an out of state entity…well good luck getting them served, much less a response. Then there’s collection efforts.
Letting the community know what’s happened let’s the rest of us choose to not accept their engagements. Think is this as a bad notification, similar to a credit reporting service.
Have you tried contacting the corporate office? I’d also file a complaint with the BBB. Be sure you’ve properly calculated the 45 “Business” days (approx 3 months). I’ve had that experience several times, and once those business days have been exceeded, I start calling and sending invoices with demand for payment email. If no response after 2nd demand letter, I call the Title company involved. I believe I downloaded a set of demand letters from the NNA website. You can also hire collections agency to pursue them.
It’s not that easy to contact their Corp HQ. And, perhaps, that’s “by design.” I could write to them (no phone contact), but I’m not sure to where in particular (i.e. which dept) I should send it. The are very clear in their instructions that “all inquiries in re: payment should be sent to a given email address.” And, of course, one keeps doing that, and they do nothing. They are, apparently, very skilled at doing nothing at that email address.
I’m also considering filing with the BBB, but they aren’t even listed on the BBB. I’d be creating a “new entry” for them, and I’m not sure what all that entails. This company, however, is a member of the NRMLA (Natl. Reverse Mortgage Loan Assoc). I might do better to complain to them… perhaps some other of their professional agencies.
Their stated time for payment is “45c ‘calendar’ days from the signing date” (not business). The first signing was on 05/30/2023 and the 2nd on 06/11/2023. So, we are long past those dates, and I feel confident in calling their accounts “delinquent.” And they have already offered me “feigned” apologies for the delays, telling me that they know they’re late, and they’ll do X,Y,Z to compensate for it, but they never do.
I believe my next move is getting the title companies on board. I don’t know how successful I’ll be with that as I’m sure they’ve been advised to not respond to notary inquires. We’ll see. Not sure about a “collection agency” as I think that might be too cost prohibitive. If I were combining that with a small claims action, then I could, potentially recover those costs as part of the action. But to hire a collection agency stand-alone, not sure. It would depend on what they’d charge me. I may also see about contacting the atty general of their HQ state (Penn) as well. But, without a “written contract” (again, by design of the SS, I think), it might be a tad difficult.
Thank you. I have already downloaded them from the NNA site. They have been sent the “Inquiry” letter already. Next will be the “appeal” letter with a few tweaks.
In Florida each county maintains their property records. I go to the Property Appraiser’s website for the county where the property is located and look it up by either owner name or address.
Then there’s another website to look up mortgages D and deeds etc etc. You can Google property records for your location and find out the proper place to go and look
Here in Pasco County, the County Clerk maintains all the vital records (Mortgages, Liens, marriage records, property deeds, NOCs, etc. etc. etc.). The Pasco County Tax Assessor (appraiser) also maintains a record of properties (i.e. parcel info, land owner of record, etc. etc).In fact, the County Clerk offers a “fraud alert” service whereby you’ll get an email if someone files a record that matches certain criteria that you set up (your name or portion of name, etc.). Or even if closely sounding like your name, you’ll get notified. Sort of like that “Home Title Lock” thing, but free to Pasco County residents.
You can, actually, look up and view any “public” documents. You just have to swear/affirm that you aren’t using them for “nefarious” purposes.
Have you used the search function for this company?
When I reached out to the VP of the title company to voice my concerns…I received an invitation to a webinar about how Notaroo was going to change the way signings happened and one of the guest speakers was none other that said VP…
I will not sign for them any longer.
Not sure what you mean by that. Do you mean I should “Google” them? I did. Did not find anything directly.
VP of Notaroo or of the title company? I think my next move is to get the title company on board for whatever that will accomplish… if anything. I suspect that the title companies may be “in on it” with Notaroo, as your quote above seems to imply (I could be wrong about that, but…)… After that, maybe file with the NRMLA. Maybe the BBB as well, even though Notaroo isn’t listed as yet on the BBB. At some point, unless they do pay, I’ll have to write it off. We’ll see. But I’ll make sure us notaries are well aware of and avoid them like the plague!
@mag3_notary Great query! It’s always wise to research & vet a new client prior to providing a definitive confirmation to them for your initial Signing Order for them. A great start of research would begin within the Notary Cafe forums Search Function.
Most members find it difficult/nearly impossible to locate the Search Function in order to access the wealth of info available within the database.
To be helpful, I’ve inserted an image for you & others [see below] to help members locate it to unlock the wisdom & knowledge of other members on the forums.
Accessing the database to locate info about potential clients has saved many of us an inordinate amount of time ‘chasing’ payments for Services professionally provided to potential non-payers . . .
At first, I was so desperate to get assignments, I’d respond yes to anything that sounded good, for fear of losing the assignment if I delayed any to do that research. Now, I’m happy to do the searching and research before and, if I get it, great. If I don’t, I’m not going to lose sleep. I will favor those services I know and who are consistent in their paying. Docs-2-Go is one of those.
I actually do know where the search function is, as it’s a staple on a lot of websties. I just didn’t bother to do it for this particular case.
there are lots of posts about this company.