Signing Agencies Commonly Take 50% Of NSA Fee - Software Systems Make Their Profits Soar

PSAs and News
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This loan signing industry is changing rapidly due to software companies like SigningOrder dot com (aka Notary Loop, Inc.) coordinating systems for agencies and title companies enabling them to keep fees low. These companies are hard core sell outs without any respect for notaries whatsoever. We were messed with already a long time ago with our notary fees quashed and hijacked disallowed as a means of collecting payment in this industry.

Now these juicers want even more juice from signing agents. One fee fits all geographic locations, at least that’s what it seems they’ve all decided on regardless of any circumstances of package size, distance, birdge tolls, scan backs, experience, etc.

Most all agencies have agreed to providing $70-$100 for a refi or purchase without regard for geographic location. Manipulators from Florida, the heart of the problem from my point of view, don’t care about the cost of living in other states so they’ve been working on software systems and forming partnerships.

In case you didn’t know, SigningOrder dot com is really Noary Loop, Inc. that is working now with SnapDocs to make our profession pimped out to cheap labor.

These agencies used to have to call signing agents to develop a mutual work partnership but now all they have to do is drink their ice tea, put their feet up on their desks and cruise along as we the signing agents hustle to get their low paying jobs done for them. Why? Because software systems are being used to accept the lowest fee possible for work.

So imagine this, you have a flow of work from title companies to distribute that you get the same amount of $100 the notary receives for real work. Ten years ago agencies were far less brazen to take 50% of the title company’s allotted free for the loan signing. They’ve become very greedy and prone to great frustration when notaries won’t accept their $75-100 offers.

Prior to the real estate market collapse in 2008, Notary Signing Agents were making big money at $300-500 per signing! I wasn’t there but I think what they’re still doing to our industry 14 years later is a crime. Notary Signing Agents should establish their own business calculating their own fee requirements and view these agencies as competitors.

Just sayin, these agencies sit around doing very little on autopilot as we do all the work! They’re arrogance is often quite breathtaking to behold as well. If the Internet is ever turned off these agencies will be back to calling us for their signings like human beings again.

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I was there. $300 - $500 is an exaggeration. However, half that isn’t.

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In your opinion why do you think the fees are different now as oppose to the time period your referencing?

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platforms (that don’t work as advertised), too many newbs (due to youtube 6-figure videos) and the persistent bs about how to succeed by taking unprofitable work.

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Hi Arichter, I heard that from many different sources how much they were making in California only.

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The real estate industry collapsed in 2007 and so did the fees crashing down to $85-100. They improved along the way, especially when Title companies called us with direct offers. They are clearly tightening up everything to provide the NSA’s with little to no profit taking every cent away whenever they possibly can. The agencies are also very hostile and arrogant. One told me after I asked her not to contact me again that my business wouldn’t likely make it, that’s how they lash out. I’m not saying all of them, but most exhibit a bad attitude toward the NSA’s.

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$300 isn’t an exaggeration, $150 is half and that’s still reachable for some of us today when circumstances allow. I’m talking about California only.

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And I’m talking over a decade ago. Inflation factors in. And, yes, CA always is in a class by itself.

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I challenge you to put your money where your mouth is and open your OWN Signing Service. I did, six months ago, and I’d like to assure you that “50% of the fee” is certainly NOT anywhere NEAR the bit that gets to stay in my accounts… but I am quite certain you would scoff at my claim. SO, I will eagerly await the news of your launch date!!

Now all you need is :
A 1M blanket Liability policy
a 1M personal E&O policy
A platform to host your Service (most have startup fees of about $3-500, and per order fees from $2-5 for EACH file, depending on the platform and number of orders… with a minimum of a few hundred a month)
An Attorney, CPA, an LLC (if you want that level of separation for your personal assets)
Another set of bank accounts
Another set of credit accounts
A whole different set of marketing materials
A whole new Marketing Plan- you’re marketing for a whole new type of business now
A Training Program for your Notaries- because new notaries aren’t always as skilled as you want, and they represent YOU now!!
An accounting program
A check writing program- can’t pay everyone by hand
A CRM to keep track of all your leads and follow up system

Oh, and don’t forget, you still have to do your OWN signings, because it isn’t going to make enough money to pay your bills for a long while.
Your first notaries are going to make errors YOU will have to pay for- out of YOUR POCKET.
You will be going to appointments they didn’t show up for.
YOU will be doing re-signs they won’t.
YOU will be doing resigns you can’t afford to PAY someone ELSE to do.
You will work three times as hard for the first year or so.
If you are lucky, and improve your attitude significantly, you might still be in business.

Signing Services aren’t taking 50% of the fee. We aren’t “out to get you”. We aren’t “greedy”. We are businesses. We are putting up large amounts of money for insurance and platforms, spending long hours out marketing to Title and Escrow and Lenders to get the accounts and orders we publish to LSAs. And, yes, we keep a percentage of that. It’s not half. I wish it WAS some days; I could USE a little rest! Autopilot my ass.

Step up or shut up.

I won’t hold my breath for that Grand Opening Date.

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I agree, I quoted as per escrow instructions or as loan agent completing a GFE $125 for Notary Services but I don’t recall notaries needing to notarize as many documents in one assignment or bringing the printed documents to signing. In fact we would already have docs and prep them with flags before notary arrived and then hand over the couple of pages for notary to handle with the signer…… it was in and out, less then 10 mins and if after hours or urgent then we paid another $100

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Just curious…how long were you an NSA before you decided to start an SS?

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Yes this signing agency ARE ARROGANT and stopping small businesses from growing. This has to STOP. Drastic measures to stop signing companies from drastically profiting off the backs of government officials aka notarize most be controlled.

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Have a feeling companies doing business with SnapDocs are all using similar software and offering same low ball offers. Notaries accepting low ball offers are hurting the business. Wish people with comments would provide state of location ~ I’m in WA. In my neck of the woods, fuel is approx $4/gal. Paper and toner prices have increased and will only get worse. Yet greedy money grubbing processors want to decrease our fees. Experienced Notaries are taking a stand but apparently they want to put us out of business.

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I can’t speak to what signing companies are retaining for their fee but I can say in my city we are normally offered by the signing companies on average between $75-90 for the same types of signings. Just as an example, refi packages range from an average of 135-225 pages depending on the type of closing and pay that $75-90 rate. We are required to print not just 1 package but 2 and quite often we have to scan back the executed set. I have yet to have an escrow or title company provide a preprinted set of documents to either me or the signer. When I create an invoice for each job, I account for the number of notarizations completed (since this money is tax-exempt), the number of pages printed (@.15 pp), the number of pages scanned (@.15 pp), and the cost of travel to both the signing and the FedEx office (@.445 pm) and including any return mileage if I have to go back. This invoice does not account for the amount of time I had to spend reviewing the package for accuracy (which can sometimes be an hour or 2) or the amount of time spent at the signer’s home conducting the signing, both of which should be billable but is not. In the end when I tally up all the charges that should be billed for I am usually logging a loss of $150 or more when compared to what I am receiving and that’s not including the amount I must set aside for quarterly taxes. Because loan signings received through signing companies are done at such a significant loss I only take them under certain circumstances. Otherwise, I only take those signings from escrow or title companies that call me direct and instead have concentrated on bolstering my general notary work. Especially that work that involves support to the legal community.

In response to gjackmanNSS, much of what you have listed as a requirement for the establishment of a signing company is no less than what is required for a notary who is running a well-structured business. I am not a signing service, but as a notary I have included in my business structure the following:

A marketing plan that encompasses all of my services (aside from time, the development of a marketing plan doesn’t add a significant amount to a business management’s cost)
A Liability policy
A $500K personal E&O policy
A platform to host my E-Notary & RON services (cost is $250 a year plus a per notarization fee)
An attorney, CPA and a bookkeeper
A separate set of bank accounts
A separate credit account (I have secured an EIN & DUNS for my company)
Several sets of marketing materials (defining the service set I am promoting or specific to the event I’m attending)
Marketing trinkets & gifts
An accounting & check writing program - I use Quickbooks to kill 2 birds with 1 stone
A CRM - This is a software that is a 1x expense and relatively inexpensive
All the necessary technological equipment & items necessary to support my business and its customers

And, if you are a conscientous notary, you own up to your mistakes and correct them not pawn them off to others. So there’s that cost too.

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Only self-employment tax

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But if your smart you can maximize this exception.

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Honestly, the angry, passive aggressive energy in your post and the way you came at the OP says enough. So if she doesn’t open her own struggling SS, in your eyes, her personal opinion is invalid? lol. “The lady doth protest too much,” is a phrase that comes to mind…

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Imagine coming into a forum specifically for notaries and then insulting all of them lmao :clown_face:

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I’ve been doing signings since 1997. This was not a big business back then. BancServ actually advertised in the S.F. newspaper looking for Notaries. I only knew of signing companies them and a guy in the Bay Area…Steve Hale, Hale Documents Service. Steve actually personally trained me. At that time we got $50 per signing via a signing company…but no printing, document prep or scanning. You got your own direct clients which could be an escrow office, officer, a loan officer, etc. Cutting out the middle man (signing company) the average signing was around $125+…again no printing, document prep or scanning. You could charge for additional services like picking up and dropping off documents. Now I also worked through the subprime lender era…they paid more as they handed out their horrible loans. I had a client who was a loan officer at Ameriquest Mortgage that I established a good relationship with. I never made less than $500 per signing and they would fly docs to me and I would charge $50 to pick up docs at the airport and $50 to drop off. This client turned me on to 5 other offices in Southern California. I was their go to Signing Agent for the Greater Bay Area. So we made more money then. Now we eat the costs the title companies and lenders use to charge their clients. A title company always charged a doc prep fee (which included print and prep costs)…I don’t see that fee anymore because we are prepping the docs basically for free. My thoughts on why the fees are different now for Signing Agents…more signing companies exist and no matter what anyone says, they are basically charging what we would charge if we did a direct signing. If they raised their fees to pay us the $150+ then maybe there is concern that the title company will cut them and come directly to us. Either way, the only thing different is now there are zillions of Signing Companies.

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Crazy huh? He basically threatened to blacklist notaries for voicing their opinion on a Notary Forum designed exactly for this purpose. WOW is this a new signing agent recruitment strategy?

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