Today, I received an email notification from a company concerning an assignment that I had completed (in-person refinance order). I am providing the email content verbatim: "I am the resolution specialist working to record the above order. A signing took place on 1/13/2026 for ‘Secondary Signer’. We have a Florida acknowledgement for ‘Primary Signer’ to attach to the mortgage but not one for ‘Secondary Signer’. Can you please complete the attached all-purpose acknowledgement for the ‘Secondary Signer’? We only need a scan for the recording; the original is not required.” After carefully reviewing the email and the attached document, I promptly called the resolution specialist to thoroughly discuss the situation. During our conversation, she explained that the CA county clerk’s office had rejected the recording of the deed. I then took the opportunity to clarify my actions by providing detailed explanations based on the Florida Notary statutes. Specifically, I explained that the “Secondary Signer” had been explicitly and clearly noted in the designated “other signer” section, which is located at the bottom of the loose acknowledgement form that I had used. I also emphasized that the specific certificate that I utilized fully adhered to Florida Section 695.25, ensuring complete compliance with state regulations. The root of the whole misunderstanding, in my opinion, occurred due to both her and the CA county clerk being demonstrably unfamiliar with Florida statutes and, specifically, that particular loose certificate. It is my professional opinion that her request was, in fact, not a legal notarial act. Firstly, I could not ethically use her blank certificate, as that would be a violation of notary practices and Florida statutes. Secondly, I could not, under any circumstances, complete and notarize that certificate to be used for a document that had already been completed and notarized. This is not an uncommon occurrence and it happens with nationwide lenders and title companies, who are not fully up to speed with all fifty states’ notarial statutes. It is, therefore, incumbent upon us, as Loan Signing Agents, to be exceptionally knowledgeable on our state’s statutes and to be effectively able to communicate our best practices to these nationwide companies regarding these specific matters. Otherwise, it is foreseeable that illegal actions will inevitably happen, and Loan Signing Agents who fail to stay current on their state’s laws will potentially face serious legal consequences. During our phone conversation, I was able to effectively articulate and demonstrate that the order had been executed and completed in accordance with all necessary procedures and legal requirements. As a result of our discussion, the resolution specialist gained a significantly enhanced comprehension of the proper methods and justifications required to effectively convey this information to the California (CA) county clerk’s office, thereby resolving the initial misunderstanding surrounding the deed recording rejection. Furthermore, to ensure ongoing support and collaboration, I proactively extended an offer of additional assistance, explicitly informing her that she could freely contact me should any further questions or issues arise, fostering a collaborative approach to problem-solving and maintaining open communication channels for future reference. At the end of the call, she reassured me that no quality occurrences will impact my rating with her company. Sometimes a simple phone call goes a long way, that emails cannot achieve.
I see Florida Secretary of State has a web page with sample certificates. Is there a sample certificate for the case where there are two signers, both of whom signed and acknowledged?
Also, the situation is not clear. Did you meet with, look at the signatures of, and take acknowledgements from, two different signers at the same time? Or did one of the signers sign and acknowledge before a different notary and you took the acknowledgement of the second signer? Or some other situation?
Thanks ashton - I’m a bit unclear about the Primary and Secondary Signer designations.
@LindaH-FL @ashton I utilized certificates provided by the National Notary Association (NNA). Their loose acknowledgment certificate features a designated line for the primary signer’s name, specifically labeled “Name of Person Acknowledging,” within the main section of the form. Furthermore, an optional section is located at the bottom of the certificate, allowing for the inclusion of the document description, date, number of pages, and any additional signers beyond those initially named. In Florida, notary certificates must contain nine essential elements. In the present situation, the employing company and the California county clerk expressed concerns regarding the absence of the second signer’s name; however, this information was, in fact, included on the certificate that was utilized. I trust this explanation provides the necessary clarification.
I would interpret the bottom section as extra information, used to insure the loose certificate is attached to the correct document. To me, listing a secondary signer at the bottom just means that some notary, somewhere, on the present date or an earlier date, took the second signer’s acknowledgement. It isn’t a statement that the notary who signed the certificate took the acknowledgement of the second signer on the date indicated, in the county indicated.
If I had to complete an acknowledgement certificate that indicated how I identified the signer like FL requires, and I identified both signers the same way, I’d put both names on one certificate, after the word “by” in the upper section, and not put any signer names in the bottom section. If I identified one signer by personal knowledge and one by produced identification, I’d fill out two loose certificates. So the first certificate might list the signer who I know personally after “by” and the other at the bottom, and vice versa for the second certificate.
In VT, I don’t have to say how I identified the signers, so I’d always list all the signers who appeared before me in the upper part of the certificate.
@ashton, I want to express my sincere gratitude for the valuable insights you’ve shared regarding the completion of that certificate. Your perspective has been incredibly helpful, and it has become clear that there are, in fact, multiple acceptable methods for completing these forms. I can confirm that, in my own practice, I have successfully utilized both of these approaches without encountering any negative consequences or issues. The collaborative nature of this forum is truly remarkable, as it provides an invaluable platform for us all to exchange our experiences, learn from one another, and collectively enhance our understanding of best practices within the notary field. That’s why I previously posted “Am I my brother’s keeper?” - it shows how we can help each other learn and succeed!
Shocking you have never received an acknowledgment kicked back if you are putting the second signer in the additional information section, as that is not in the body of the certificate. I would be curious to hear NNA’s interpretation of executing the document as such.
Agree with kiersten.tabion. I did a little research and found that the particular form that (I believe) cfletcher is referring to is for an INDIVIDUAL. In fact, both Florida and the NNA state “Florida Individual Acknowledgment.” Florida does so in Florida Statutes Section 695.25. Statutes & Constitution :View Statutes : Online Sunshine
Insofar as the NNA form, may I refer you to #13 of the instructions. Here’s the PDF: 05181_fl_ack_individual.pdf
What I cannot discern is whether Florida means for the notary to use a separate Acknowledgment for each signer or whether all signers can be entered into one Acknowledgment. I found separate Florida Acknowledgments for Individual, Partner, Corporation, LLC, Individual acting as POA and finally for Public officer, trustee, personal representative. I did not find one for 2 or more persons acting in their own right. Perhaps the FL SOS should clarify this matter??
I do, however, agree with Carl that a notary (at least in Florida and California [Carl in FL, me in CA]; I don’t know about other states) does not just willy-nilly fill out a new Ack and send it to hiring party. The notary must again meet with signer(s) and have her/him/them re-acknowledge the document THEN complete a new notarial cert with the current date.
The title “Individual Acknowledgement” merely separates it out to mean that ack is not for use for “Partner, Corporation, LLC, Individual acting as POA and finally for Public officer, trustee, personal representative.” It means, as it says in Yolicue’s reference, “For an individual acting in his or her own right”
You make a good point there. Many people today (including myself) prefer to communicate mostly by email and text message. That usually works, except there are some situations where actual phone calls are far more efficient, eliminating the annoying “back and forth” while trying to get something resolved.
Having worked in government in CA, this does not surprise me at all. Government workers in CA can be very wrong and very heavy-handed. My mother used to call in ‘positively wrong’; meaning they are so convinced of their position that they do not bother to investigate any other scenario. I’m glad you didn’t have to deal with the county clerk directly. Sounds like you handled it beautifully.
@kiersten.tabion “While I have encountered occasional concerns regarding the use of the optional section on the acknowledgment form for listing a second signer, these issues have always been easily resolved through a straightforward explanation. Given that the National Notary Association (NNA) designed this acknowledgment form, I actually reached out to them directly to confirm its proper usage. The NNA representatives confirmed that the optional section is indeed permissible for designating a second signer. From my experience, I have consistently utilized this method, and I have not encountered any problems or negative consequences as a result.
As a California notary, we may never utilize th optional section for a second signer. It would be rejected 100% of the time!
I just went and looked at that form - and that is the most bizarre form I have ever seen. I don’t see how listing a name at the bottom for “Signers other than above” constitutes notarization of that individual’s signature. And as to this portion of your above post - “Given that the National Notary Association (NNA) designed this acknowledgment form, I actually reached out to them directly to confirm its proper usage. The NNA representatives confirmed that the optional section is indeed permissible for designating a second signer.” - of course they will. But you have just cited a prime example of what we “oldies” have been saying for years about that association’s issuance of bad information.
In all honesty, if I were you @cfletcher I would discontinue use of that form and use only the form provided in our statutes.
@LindaH-FL I appreciate you sharing your perspective on this matter, as I am always receptive to learning about diverse methodologies within our profession. To summarize my understanding, the National Notary Association’s (NNA) certificate forms do, in fact, fulfill all nine essential elements mandated for Florida notary certificates, as outlined in Section 117.05(04) and (13) of the Florida Statutes. Specifically, the inclusion of the optional section on the acknowledgment form, which allows for the listing of a second signer, serves to create a direct and legally binding connection between that individual and both the specific certificate and the associated document being notarized. In my review of the Florida Statutes, particularly within bullet point section 117.05(13), I noted the explicit statement that “Florida Statutes does not preclude the use of other forms,” which provides further support for the utilization of the NNA forms in our practice. In practice, we are allowed to use most other state’s certificates, if those certificates have nine essential elements. In reading the Florida’s Governor’s Reference Manual for Notaries Public, we know there are a few “gray areas” in those statues. That’s probably why there’s a disclosure that states “ This manual has been prepared to educate Florida notaries public about the laws governing their duties and is not intended a legal advice” and it goes on to state: “it may be advisable for you or your customer to seek the advice of a licensed attorney.”
@cfletcher Well, we are going to have to agree to disagree on the use of this cert as I do not feel it meets Florida standards at all as to the “other signer” - simply stating the name of “other signers” does not meet the nine elements required for that signer. In fact, it doesn’t even indicate that the signer acknowledged to you or swore to you…it just states their name.
Yes, we can use other forms provided the nine elements are met - and helps us with certs from other states. This does not apply here. I would advise running this particular form by our SOS before using it further - get it in writing from them that the name written in as “Other Signer” automatically includes them as included in the ack or jurat. IMO there is no notarial act associated with the wording at the bottom for the “Other Signer”.
All due respect to you Carl.
This is how I do it, in Fl.!