I have contacted many time by phone and email and have gotten nothing. all most 90 days past at this point. There really needs to be come support for the signing agents. This is the 2nd non paying job I have done this year, the other fraudulent company is NEMA. Do not take work from Missy at NEMA never will pay you.
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I’m so sorry this has happened to you, and to other notaries.
I’ve had to go head to toe with AOE and finally got paid but this was several months ago.
Signing companies need to be held to the same stringent criteria’s and industry standards as notaries, with penalties in place, however my understanding is they are not. There should also be an escrow account set-up should they go under all outstanding accounts would be paid from it. This is very wrong.
When a signing company gets paid through escrow, they are part of the real estate transaction. It’s a RESPA violation and fraud when they do not pay a notary for their services as part of the transaction. The escrow/title company can be held liable too for unpaid accounts.
I’ve communicated my thoughts with the secretary of state’s office in Oregon and the NNA, suggesting procedures and statues are put in place, which I was hoping the NNA would lobby for. Obviously I’m only one voice. I call on others to join with the same advocacy in order to push for change.
Currently fly by night signing companies are established with many who should never be in business. I honestly do not know the process for signing companies to secure assignments, but would like to learn. Escrow/title companies should have an obligation to engage reputable firms.
Recently I found out one signing company was no longer licensed to do business in the state and their business was suspended.
It’s tough enough to be out there getting business and then have to deal with this, wait 30+ days for payment with hopes you will.
Encourage others to express your thoughts with your Secretary of State’s office.
Pamela Thorsch
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Thank you for your time.
First thank you for the posts and replies. Posts/replies in general seem to be fewer and more far between these days. …And I hope anyone with outstanding invoices with AOE (or other SS) gets paid soon! Most of us are frustrated and many struggling, and I pray the new “House” at some point next year starts turning the tide on our current national fiscal direction in a manner resulting in a rebounding RE market.
AOE must not be completely out of business (I hope), I received and completed an order from them just a few weeks ago, was able to reach the owner by email and phone fairly promptly when I discovered docs were incomplete on SO. I have received occasional offers and completed several signings for AOE, many months apart when the offer was decent enough to respond to and received payments at around 30 - 45 days each time, only having to remind him/them on my first AOE signing about 10 months ago.
Acknowledging the heads-up in this thread re AOE, it might be prudent to start ramping up the calling/emailing at 30 days, like I am having to do with several others. I have found in this RE cycle that measured reminders and subtle pressure has worked best, as I continue to squeeze a few more deals and checks out of the slow payers than I might otherwise have, as a Tally at the end of the month, than perhaps if I had flamed-up the situation…maybe.
I look at it a little bit this way … everyone is slower, and if I am to rely on a portion of my business to be Platform and SS sourced, I should expect it to also be slower for them with likely higher indirect overhead, and the impact on many of them compounded, with brokers and lenders downsizing and/or going out of business and more and more Title companies going to RON and Escrow Officers keeping signings in-house.
Looking at one Platform which seems to come up a lot on this forum - Snap Docs (and their contacted SS) seems to have a horrible rep on every forum I I am aware of, for the most part, going back years now, yet some still seem to love them, and keep them in business. Last week I spoke to a remote Loan Originator for a large lender who I was doing a signing for through ServiceLink. The LO expressed she was thinking she might want to become an AZ Notary/NSA because her LO income had dropped by more than 50% and she thought she might make more as an NSA (my bad, was caught off-guard, and chuckled out loud). I asked her why she thought that. She responded she thought NSAs got paid at least $100 or more per signing because when their company uses SnapDocs in CA, and they put $200 in the LE/CD/Alta for the signing fee…and I chuckled out loud aging. Most of you can imagine how I had to hold my tongue… but it was confirmation that Snapdocs seems to be surviving … by at least the SD players keeping 70% of the deal, and funding the SD model. I still receive offers from SD (I never take), nearly every day. On one time over a year ago I thought about “firing them”, as other have claimed on this forum they have. But I decided to consider them somewhat of a litmus test or canary in the mine…When I don’t receive any more notices through them, I will know the low paying SS may be all be fading away (a good thing in the long run), shifting remaining business to better players, I hope.
Sorry I digress…However, finding and working with a slow paying (but hanging on) SS player in this market is possibly a way to make a few more $$, and when I find those, I sprinkle a little sugar on those relationships rather than vinegar (perhaps delusional I will get paid being closer to top of their list), by letting them know I will be patient and work with them on payment, if we have an understanding that is coming by XYZ date, or the claws will come out)…standing to fight another day together, should the day come. Unless you have a bunch of direct escrow and title relationships up your sleeve, it might be better to hesitate torching a SS relationship right now, until all other options otherwise have been explored - especially if things start to turn around next year.
I appreciate this forum for the messages of alarm when it comes to a potentially bad SS ), so that I can verify and choose to avoid the really troubled players and reconfirm my own research. However, I have a couple of those allegedly bad players as actual good revenue streams for me over the last couple of years, after developing a relationship of understanding and trust with then despite a negative rep on this forum and others. I do encourage others to avoid SS on the SD platform (most are notably low payers unless last minute and desperate), not to be pursued for any reason IMO, even if they pay fast - I say let their biz drown, they are on SD for a reason - these SS are cheap as a rule, one in particular (you know who they are), and are only reasonable as rare exception, which always seems to be an unfamiliar SD SS, at last minute or an evening/weekend signing (because their top tier was busy?)
The rare posts of a good player, and the occasional pearl of who to call/email when chasing down a back-door-way into a SS who is ghosting (like this one), are the posts that mostly get my attention these days - keep them coming, they help us all, one way or another.
As far as our negative posts impacting a SS in a negative way or in any way, IMO, I really question that. My thoughts are it’s a numbers game … millions of Notaries in this country, ten’s and tens of thousands NSAs ( ore than the industry can support right now), and how many on this forum?? and other forums?? then drill down to active regular viewers, reviewers, posters as a % of the industry population? …I’m not sure any SS company is really challenged in terms of finding Notaries/NSAs, for even last-minute signings, if they need to, even if they have bad forum reps. It cracks me up (and not in a good way) how almost every SS company website touts the 10’s of thousands of Notaries in their “nationwide network”… if they can’t find one from their preferred and second tiers, they just check the profiles here on Notary Cafe, or one or two other forums, NNA, etc., and roll the dice…I’m guessing somebody always bites and take their deals, regardless of how low the fee is. And when “rarely” no one does, you see the suspiciously same offer (time/place/fee) show up from another platform or SS a short time later, for the same or higher fee, maybe now a TBD time, and then the thumb racing begins…
I do wish all members of this Forum and Notary Cafe “Blessed Holidays”, and I pray for a better 2023 for all of us!
Signing off for 2022
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Yes and, unfortunately, this scammer happens to be a Notary Loan Signing Agent who got me. Sigh
I wish I had the same experience I have left multiple voicemails and sent multiple emails and even spoke to someone once and still no payment after 90 days.
NEMA is ridiculous. No one is there to speak to and the last 2 appointments I was assigned were cancelled without notice. They didn’t tell me the signer did! No response to any voicemails or emails. STAY FAR AWAY very unprofessional with no regard to your time.
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Hello pthorsch,
I should have been more careful when doing a signing for AOE (Dylan Torres) also known as Will. When I saw your response, I decided to do the signing. I drove 4 hours and did over $300 pages and never received compensation. I have sent emails and made several phone calls but still no response. When I contacted Stewart Title to see if I could get help that way, it too was a dead end. I was told that after the Title company realized his unethical business practices, they decided to cut ties with him. When I reported it to the Signing Order platform, no help there either. I’m glad you got paid, however, other notaries have not received payment either. I suppose this scammer has to have at least 1 notary on his side. Shame on AOE and Will for not compensating hard working notaries for their time and expenses. Very discouraging, but I believe when you do others wrong, you reap what you sow.
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I’m so sorry that happened to you. I did a job for them back in September and no payment either. Not sure what I will do. I’m thinking reporting to the BBB.
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@LynnHann There are several posts above yours with specific helpful information, which you may have already reviewed (so, please forgive my suggestion - if you have already reviewed them).
Also, I strongly suggest you review this post by @rparker as it contains insightful & helpful Step-by-Step Instructions to assist you in this matter. Here is the direct Notary Cafe url for your reference:
Are you sending the PAST DUE invoices to the title company?
@LynnHann I’m unable to discern who your query is directed toward . . . I’d review the threads to determine who was successful & then emulate their process to achieve payment.
Also, here is a specific screenshot that you may find helpful from the following post:
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There is a plethora of information regarding invoice submissions & how some Notary Cafe members did achieve payment of the same already existent within the Notary Cafe database. Specifically, here is a post I created that encapsulates all (or nearly so) the threads on AOE/NEMA/Missy Johnson, etc. It will serve you well to read all of them to enable you to glean the germane data to achieve the best results in your quest:
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Professionally/Personally, I have no proverbial dog in this fight. I’m providing insights, guidance, reference previous posts, etc. to assist other Notary Cafe members who are seeking assistance with nonpayment status of their invoices.
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Hi LynnHann,
I tried going that route, could not find him under his new business name, (AOE). However, I did find him under the business name he obviously destroyed due to his relationship issues with business partners. Never Sleep Notary. I can only imagine why he can’t sleep; I wouldn’t be able to sleep at night either, if I were scamming other notaries out of their hard earned money and time. Sorry you got bit too by a not so nice notary and LSA. BTW, I did file a scam deal with the BBB in hopes to save others from getting bit too!!!
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Filing a complaint in today’s world with the BBB carries very little or no weight. Most businesses are not even a member of the BBB anymore and the BBB has no authority to make even their members do anything. They may pass the complaint on to the business and the business may or may not choose to respond, but that’s it. Google reviews and comparable sites are how people effectively complain in today’s age. Legitimate businesses live and die from reviews. Fly by night businesses don’t care about their reputations and/or don’t realize how powerful their reputation is in succeeding long-term.
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Thank you, RoadRunner (great name, btw). This makes a lot of sense, probably why I couldn’t find him on Google.
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I’m glad to see my Notary Friends are doing their due diligence against Mr. Torres who is notorious for this kind of behavior. Listen, the BBB complaints may or may not work but it’s time he gets a taste of his own medicine. All he has to do is call them and tell them that he hired you and they’ll remove it. And just like his last business he just marked it as closed and filed for a new business name.
If he were an honest person, then we could work with him- but he is not and does this repeatedly. That’s not honest. Now, he processes through Signing Order which means every one of you need to report him to support@signingorder.com. Let them know that this is a new company name as he may have been kicked off before. If enough Notaries complain they will remove him from sending orders to anyone. Ask them to remove him until all Notary complaints are resolved and not to be able to send out orders.
NOW, HE WORKS AT CHICAGO TITLE IN SCOTTSDALE ACCORDING TO HIS LINKED IN PUBLIC PROFILE LOOK HIM UP ON LINKED IN AT DYLANWTORRESS
YOUR ORDERS MAY HAVE NOT BEEN THERE’S BUT SINCE CHICACO TITLE IS OWNED BY FIDELITY NATIONAL TITLE AS A SUBSIDARY THEY NEED TO BE LET KNOWN WHAT HE HAS DONE. LETTERS TO THEIR CORPORATE OFFICE ABOUT THIS BEHAVIOR WHILE WORKING FOR THEM MIGHT GET HIM FIRED OR AT LEAST SET HIM STRAIGHT NOT TO KEEP DOING THIS. I would advise against calling him at work at either of the Scottsdale Branches because that may go against laws of collection. But a letter to the corporate offices letting them know about an ongoing problem within the Notary Community when he works so closely with Notaries couldn’t hurt either. If they get enough anonymous letters, then they will probably let him go. He shouldn’t have a position like this to take advantage of Notaries. I mean, you get to work with a Title Company (one of the largest in the country) be Fidelity Approved… and then burn so many Notaries? You probably want to write the corporate office of Fidelity and Chicago Title since Chicago is owned by Fidelity. When we attempted an employment verification for him at Chicago Title, they made us call the Fidelity corporate for verification.
Adding the title companies’ names and addresses to this forum that he hired you from will also bring it up in google searches as Notary Cafe is pretty strong. For instance, I was hired by AOE who was contracted by Stewart Title located at XYW and was not paid. They don’t need that kind of press at the moment.
You can also get his personal information from his 123NotaryListing to give him a personal call on his cellular phone. He may not answer his business phone. You can also leave reviews on that listing as well. Seems Jeremy Belmont is MIA these days, so he probably won’t be able to get them removed. His listing link is: Dylan Torres | Results | Find Notary & Signing Agents | 123notary.com
If you aren’t able to get your payment you can also leave a negative review on the Title Agency that hired him or at least vocalize to them that you weren’t paid if you still have access to the documents. Escrow officers are hurting for business right now in a downturned market and they don’t need this kind of press! I’ve seen Notaries who worked with him for Clear Title, Stewart Title, and working on finding more.
You can also try to file a complaint with the Arizona Attorney General. If enough people file, the complaint against him they will investigate his business. I tried to post the link here but it won’t let me. Just Google Arizona Attorney General Business Complaint and follow the prompts.
Hope this helps you with the fight. He got a good friend of mine a year ago and this is how she got her invoice paid. He’s not afraid to take chances and if it were anyone with an overlooked invoice that would be one thing but this is habitual and intentional.
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I have also been not paid by AOE Signings, LLC, Dylan Torres. My refi was completed in April and have not been able to contact for payment since then. I have placed a complaint against this company in Signing Order as I hope that everyone has done. He needs to not be able to get signings and not pay us.
He also works for Chicago Title Office in AZ currently.
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In another post I provided the link to the three people at Fidelity National Title you should send a similar email to: Corporate Office – Fidelity National Title Agency (fntarizona.com) Feel free to copy and paste the same email below if you want. Or change it a little, or a lot. Just remember to remain professional!
This email is being addressed to Mary Lou Paulk, Diane Day, and Jennifer Douthit,
**I am only one of many Notaries who service Fidelity National Title and would like to bring to your attention a possible scheme that Notaries throughout the country are concerned with. My anonymity at this time is for concern for my own work safety as we all know the professionalism that Fidelity requires of it’s Notary representatives and I do not want to put that at risk. Nor would any Notary out there. You are strict but you are great and that is why we love you and don’t want to rock the boat. **
**Now this email specifically involves two possible employees Dylan Torres and Cindy Canales. Please note: that there is only speculation of Cindy Canales being involved in this possible scheme but Dylan Torres who also list himself employed by your company is definitely in some trouble with Notaries throughout the country. And, we are asking for your immediate attention & help. **
Within the last two years Dylan has opened two companies. The first was Never Sleep Notary and the second is now called AOE Signings. Many notaries have reviewed their signing packages to find that Cindy Canales was the escrow officer on the files. When they could not reach Dylan for payment they contacted Cindy who at the time was working for Stewart Title Agency and was told she would never work with him again and had fired him as a Signing Agency. You may read the time line on the very popular website Notary Cafe to confirm details for yourself. Simply google and search for Dylan Torres AOE Signings and it will pop to the top. Her name is now gaining traction as well as Notaries are being encouraged to reach out to you for an investigation which we hope you will conduct.
**We do not believe this is a “down-turn” in the market issue as Dylan simply “closed” one business without paying Notaries and then continued to open a new one where he is now doing the same. Several calls and attempts have been made to him from many Notaries. Now the investigation for all of these poor hard workers, many of which support Fidelity, are seeing these two individuals are now employed at Fidelity National Title but it is not clear if they work in the same office. Notaries are concerned how it could be possible with how much Dylan owes Notaries how he could be employed with the one company we all want to work for- as his short comings to not seem to be a mistake but intentional. Even worse, Notaries are becoming concerned that this may be an intentional action. We, as a whole, wonder how someone who has hurt our workforce so greatly is able to earn a pay check from one of our biggest aspirations as a hiring party. It just doesn’t make sense. **
**I, and the Notaries I represent, understand you are not able to truly verify employment for us or will not be able to share any details. We simply would like to ask you if you would please investigate if these two individuals have sent orders to Notaries from Fidelity through any third party (that could have an affiliation through Dylan Torres) to put an end to it. And, if he happens to be approved by Fidelity National Title as a vendor company to place a hold on his approval until you may clearly see if he’s harming other Notaries in the community. **
**Just as Fidelity National Title stretches far and wide- so does our great work force of Notary Signing Agent Contractors. **
Thank you so much for your time and consideration. No reply is needed. We just hope you will help us in doing the right thing by not allowing this to happen to so many people.
Hello,
First and foremost I would like you all to know that I am sincerely sorry for the issues you have all dealt with regarding Dylan Torres. Yes AOE was vetted by Stewart Title Vendor Management. Dylan Torres affirmed to us that the reason for the change from Never Sleep to AOE was simply due to a name change. We do not have access to his bank records to know if he was having issues. Also I still currently work for Stewart Title and have been with Stewart Title for 10 years this May. I worked for Fidelity Title in 2003-2008. Dylan Torres is in NO WAY SHAPE OR FORM related to ANY ties whatsoever to me, personally or professionally. Our lending client requested his services, so we had his company vetted and sent orders his way. The moment I was informed of this forum and the issues of notaries not being paid, I contacted Vendor Management and we IMMEDIATELY discontinued sending him any orders whatsoever. We demanded proof of payment for all the notaries who reached out to us and we got the run around from Dylan Torres as well. I work for Stewart Title in Anaheim, CA and have been an Escrow Officer for 24 years. I have personal local notaries whom I’ve worked with for that same duration of time who not only have become friends but are also like family. I understand and value the job of Notary Publics. Any individual notary who is approved with us does get paid directly via invoice. However when it comes to a Signing Service, that company is paid as they are the client who is hiring out individual notaries. I mainly work with Universal Notary who has a stellar reputation. I have worked with them for almost 10 years, with the exception of the short period of time that we sent orders to Dylan Torres as requested by our client. I just wanted to let you all know that I was not aware of his unethical work practices until one of you actually directly sent me the link to this forum. I’ve even provided some of you his personal notary commission number to be able to report him. I wish there was a way I was notified even sooner so we could have put an end to him even sooner than we did.
Update: Dylan Torres recently updated and confirmed his new cell phone number with an online Notary Platform to (602) 390-5113.
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