Horrible Experience with No Valid ID - I am interested in your input here

Notary Experiences
1

I just had one of the worst experiences yet. It started off ok. I got a request to sign a VA refinance packet, so it had 200 pages (x2 for two copies so 400-page print count). The fee requested was too low, so I requested my standard fee and was awarded the job at my requested fee. This took place on 12/24/25. I printed up the packet, was ready to go, and let the signer know this packet required 2 forms of valid ID to sign, and to please have them ready. The signing was scheduled for 12/26/25.

I arrived early, and so did she. I requested the ID to start, and it’s all downhill from here. To start, the signer lives in a very rural area where most notaries don’t go, so she drove an hour into town to meet me. She gave me a military ID card that expired in 2010. I stated that that is not acceptable because of how old it is. She tried to tell me that military never expires, and she gets on base with it all the time. I gently request a Driver’s License, to which after digging through her purse, she said she forgot it at home (which is an hour away), I ask if she has anything else on the list, such as a passport, next she gives me a social security card with her maiden name on it, which she never got updated. I again said this won’t work. She was able to dig up a copy of her ID on her phone, which although was valid, I looked it up, and I don’t feel comfortable not having the physical ID to validate.

Of course, she views this as my fault as she “has her ID” on her phone, and I am just being the mean guy to prevent the transaction from moving forward. I call the contact on the information page of the assignment which is the title company. They were VERY understanding and respectful to my situation. They said it’s frustrating but not my fault, I met, printed, and informed the signer. While I was on the phone the signer said she was going to drive the DOL to buy a new ID and then left me at the coffee shop. I am very frustrated as she thinks I was going to wait for this, and regardless, it won’t work anyway because she would get a temp ID with no picture on it. I explain this to the title company, and they said don’t waste more of your time. The signer was not prepared, and at this point, she needs to drive home, get her ID and they asked if I am willing to reschedule later today if that happens. I said yes, I will make it happen, regardless of the time.

Currently I am in limbo. I left the coffee shop, she is at the DOL and who knows when she would be back, but this is all insane to me. If this does happen to reschedule later for today, she is going to be LIVID with me, regardless of the fact that this was 100% on her.

Just curious what other thoughts and comments were on this situation.

Thanks,

3 Likes
2

Firstly, a belated Merry Christmas to you!

Secondly, one of the most pertinent, and prime objective tasks we have and that is instilled to us, is the fact that we MUST be able to properly identify the signer with a valid (not expired) government issued photo ID. I will not ever understand why this seems to be something that some signors never truly comprehend as being the one “task” we can not just skim over. This is primarily put in place for protection. For the signor and for us, as notaries. It is put in place to prevent fraud. Period. We are there to authenticate them and their signature. That’s all. If we can’t do that, then we can’t move forward with executing the notarization.

Since most assignments are with signors we do not personally know, how can we properly complete this portion without it?:

image
image254Ă—126 6.81 KB

In summary, you did everything correctly. We always take steps to educate the signors prior to meeting, so they are prepared and no one’s time is wasted.

Wishing you a smooth completion of this assignment.

V/R,

Karina

2 Likes
3

Do not hold yourself responsible for the failures of others. You did your job. They were not adequately and legally prepared. That’s on them. Move on.

4 Likes
4

Thanks. I agree. Basically, the title company said I will get a portion of the fee regardless of what happens from here to pay for time/print (which honestly $20 probably doesn’t cover, but whatever). They asked if I would reach out to her again. I just left her a message and said I will make today work for sure, if you come prepared. I have not heard back yet. I almost don’t want to have to deal with this if it does materialize, as I know she will be so mad, and of course, in her mind, I am at fault. But I’ll give it my best effort to get the job done….

5

We can never be responsible as to someone else’s perception. If she believes it is your fault, that is her perception. You know you did everything possible to educate her as to the ID verification process. If anything, she is mad at herself for not being properly prepared for this transaction. If she decides to go ahead and meet again with the proper ID, then awesome! If not, use this experience as a learning opportunity. Perhaps, next time, send the signor an example of valid and acceptable IDs (even though we sound like broken records) to ensure they are not “surprised” when they show up with their expired ID or Kroger’s card and advise that is not a valid/acceptable form of ID.

I hope this helps. Good luck and happy signing!

V/R, Law Handwriting GIF by NeighborlyNotary®

Karina

1 Like
6

The saga continues. Title said my state can accept a credible witness, where I obtain ID from two witnesses, they sign an affidavit and take an oath that they verify the identity of the person signing in place of ID. I have never done this, but looked it up and it does look like something that is accurate. So we are now back on with this in place of a primary ID for the signer. Interesting.

1 Like
7

I have done that with a signer whose license was expired and they never got a new one and don’t drive. So two friends came and verified her ID on an affidavit.

When I do any reverse I confirm ID availability before I print the documents.

2 Likes
8

@RickOShay Not sure where you’re located but here in FL part of what the CWs have to wear to is that it is “difficult if not impossible” for the signer to obtain another ID. Since you stated she had her DL at the house, or was getting another one from the DOL, CWs cannot apply here (in FL)

I feel bad for you - this is incredibly frustrating and I hope this works out for you - and you need more than $20 to print a 400 page package AND travel..JMO

Best of luck…keep us posted.

1 Like
9

I have this on my phone. When I’m on the phone with the client, I let them know I am texting them with the list of id’s that can be used, but I have to have 1 from the primary forms list and it must be current. If the packet requires 2 forms, I let them know it can be any from primary or the secondary list.

Don’t know if this will help you in the future, but something to keep in your back of your mind.

patriot-act-full-page-re
patriot-act-full-page-re1087Ă—806 131 KB

2 Likes
10

@johnsonps306 that was my procedure also - going so far as to ask them to please read me the name that is on each DL

1 Like
11

I concur with the responses you received on your post. Let me add:

  1. Military ID (I am quite certain) has an expiration date on it. That’s because (among other things) the military does NOT want anyone not currently serving to present an ID that would suggest otherwise and the expiration date serves that purpose. Who carries a military ID that’s 16 years out-of-date? I’m betting that this signer NEVER gets on any military base with a 16-year expired ID.
  2. The signer is in violation of every state’s laws regarding operating any motor vehicle with a CURRENT, valid driver’s license on them. If the license is expired and/or us no longer needed, it must be replaced by a valid state-issued ID card. (This may not be required in every state, I don’t know). Who operates a motor vehicle and leaves their driver’s license at home? Especially when signing for a VA loan after being advised to present TWO forms of current/valid ID at the loan signing!!!
  3. Social Security cards are possibly acceptable as secondary ID if the name on the card matches exactly the name on another current/valid ID. Who carries an invalid SS card with a maiden name on it? What good does it do? I can’t be used for anything.
  4. ID is not really ID if it cannot be handled and inspected by the notary. Too easy to fake/forge/counterfeit such items.
  5. What is DOL and who “buys” a “new” ID card? Where’s the photo of the holder on such an ID? Is there a physical description? Other vital requirements that authenticate the card?

Nah, you did your job; don’t compromise. Be courteous, professional and hold your ground. To do otherwise puts you at high risk and for what? Do the right thing and don’t forget to make detailed notes in your journal about this incident. You’ll likely need them later.

Happy New Year.

2 Likes
12

Credible witnesses work as a last resort, but most notaries aren’t really familiar with all of the rules concerning them. You may have to know the rules for the notary exam, but rarely, if ever, use them in real life, so you forget.

13

As a military veteran and retiree I find the ID problem extremely troubling. Nobody knows the importance of ID more than a veteran. Most military IDs have expiration dates. Old retiree IDs will have an INDEF expiration and are still valid. The newer ones have an expiration date if the retiree is under 65. Some retirees over 65 will have INDEF on the new ID cards but TSA computers had a problem seeing that as a valid expiration date so some of the over 65 retirees do have new ID cards with an expiration date so there is no hard rule on this one.
All active duty (and reserve) ID cards have an expiration date. I had an old style active duty ID card with INDEF as the expiration but those are all obsolete and will be confiscated if used at a gate. In fact, any expired ID is supposed to be confiscated at the gate so getting on base all the time with it is not a realistic statement. All the new style military IDs have a chip in them that can be used for signing documents, unlocking computers, and lots of other things. Because these chips don’t last forever and it is important to replace them before they fail, all current military CAC (common access cards) will have an expiration date.
I do not understand how someone can have a social security card and a military ID with a different name. The social security card is part of the record that backs the validity of the military ID. Most likely scenario is she got a new social security card but could only find the older one.

I am glad that you refused the signing. There were so many red flags it was just impossible to ignore. At best she was incredibly unprepared and tried to BS you. She knew she was wrong. At the worst, you will just have to use your imagination.

14

Thanks. So we ended up doing it with 2 credible witnesses who took an oath that they know her personally in place of ID. It was her parents.

Yeah, I’ve done a ton of notaries over the years and this was one of the craziest.

1 Like
15

Good job getting this one done!

However, I will say this. I don’t know what state RickOShay is located in. I’m in California and most (if not all) stipulations for using credible witnesses are the same here as in Florida – one of the items CWs are attesting to is that they know the signer does not have a valid government-issued photo ID and that it is impossible for that signer to get one. As Linda H-FL stated, given that statement, I wouldn’t be able to use CWs.

Most of us have probably run across a similar scenario. During the confirmation call, we ask signer if they have a valid government-issued photo ID. They say yes then show up with an expired driver’s license or expired passport. So, I’ve taken to clarifying my initial question with “your ID is not expired, right?” It may seem redundant but we know why we do it. :wink:

3 Likes
16

Thanks.

So how the story ended was that she thought she left it at home, someone at her home couldn’t find it so it was declared lost. So her parents were the credible witnesses.

17

Just walk. You told her in advance what she needed and she didn’t provide it. Tell the signing company you acquire full fee on this. And if they need to reassign it, it would be a new order.

1 Like
18

Their signer is not prepared with adequate id..thats a long ride..i would ask and expect the full fee.

I never accepted anything less.

If they wont do it..excuse yourself ..learn a lesson. ..and go home .

It doesnt matter if they give u a assignment again.

If they cant inform their signers or especially respect your time and effort….i wouldnt take a job from them .

$20. Is a slap in the face screw you notary.

yes ive been there ..but unless they could give me assurance of PROPER ID ..especially for a long drive on a holiday eve ? Title owes you your full fee..dont be afraid to ask for it.

3 Likes
19

Hold up…Credible witnesses are not supposed to be relatives or immediate family. I would have declined.

3 Likes
20

How in the world can a relative be considered a “credible witness”?

3 Likes