Ok. Lets get to the Nittty - Gritty. We all know that the Notary amount shown on the HUD is suppose to include other costs for the Title Company. Where our ‘notary’ cost is folded in.
Therefore to ascertain how much OUR fee is SPLIT between the SS and ourselves. WE need to know what the SS charges the Title/Bank/etc. for their service!
Agents you represent ALL 50 states. I’m sure some of you know the answer. Of course, there are different prices depending on the TYPE of loan as some are big packages where others are 30 pages.
I would like to have a consensus for charges, because it will be different in the various states. This way we could KNOW where we stand regarding our fees. AND the newbies would hopefully know that taking $50, $65 signings lowers the price for ALL of US.
We had one revealed price of $200 charged by the SS, who paid $125 to the NSA. That seems very fair. I thank all who respond to this POST. Please DON’T tell me its none of my business. We are part of this business and WE should know how to answer the client sitting in front of us asking WHY we’re getting $450 to spend an hour with them. Being truthful and NOT sounding EVASIVE.
which we do, BECAUSE WE DONT KNOW THE TRUTH !
So my “2 cents” on this (because you asked) is this:
First: The size of the package or even the type of loan is only a fraction of what goes into the costs when negotiating fees. Believe it or not location is big in negotiating fees in addition to the number of signers there are, is there a POA, a Trust, Witnesses required, Government Program (VA, FHA, USDA) etc. The higher the loan “maintenance” the higher the fee. Also, the harder it is to find a notary due to location, the higher the fee (travel time). This is why all should know that notaries advocating for an industry standard in regards to fees, that it just cant be done realistically, and most definitely not fairly. The notary that has to travel 60 minutes one way to a signing should not receive the same pay as the notary that has to walk 3 blocks to the signing. The notary spending 2 hours on the road for an hour signing (3 hours total) should obviously get paid way more.
Second: It’s not the notaries fault for accepting a $50 job. Everyone’s profit margin is different, especially for new agents trying to build their business and reputation. It is the SS fault for offering these fees because they know these facts exist, and they know someone is out their willing to take the job for that amount for one or all of those reasons.
Third: Of all the fees the client pays to close on the loan, I have yet to hear anyone of my signers be concerned about what I get paid, but in any event, rest assured its very simple to tell them you don’t get the whole $450 because there are others involved getting paid to spend time and money researching and looking for qualified, diligent and error free signing agents such as you and I.
Well I’ll go ahead and be the first to say what you don’t want to hear. IT IS NONE OF YOUR BUSINESS. You are hired for a job. You agree to a fee for said job. You are paid for the job. End of story.
John is well aware of my stance on this, which is in line with yours, Annie…in fact I believe my debate with him about this is what prompted him to make the statement to not say it’s none of our business. Another thread another time.
I sense a movement being formed here a la Matt Miller’s successful campaign to block RON in California. I, for one will not partake in this discussion or movement.
Very good question, glad you asked. Generally the Title pays $200, as you stated if you receive $125 - fair. One title company pays more when it’s same day, $150.00, generally pick them up because the packages are also straight forward. One title co - I have an app on my phone so they just schedule me, but, packages can be rather large. charge $25 extra for Covid- some borrowrers are problems.
Thank you. cnelson. How simple it all can be. I understand that some TC’s use more than one SS.
I have a friend who confirmed a signing with one SS and even confirmed with the signer only to have another agent confirm with the signer. And took the job as the second agent had the doc’s. I don’t know if this is common?
This should make your head explode - the CFPB is forming a task force working on coming up with a standardized bundled settlement package - all settlement costs under one lumped sum - guess borrowers are getting too confused with all the numbers - it’s published under RESPA news.
First I would like to say you are wrong as to standardized fees. That doesn’t mean they need to be the same In every state and every county. That can very. As to your comment. You will never make the money you deserve if you have no clout. That’s never.
Second if you what to drive 2 hours that’s your own problem. It’s stupid. You could charge more than the standard rate for excessive travel. If they need you they pay. It’s on them not you.
If you get a job close by that’s good for you. What would you like to do give them some money back. Yea right.
As for new people they should get pay well. This is a living. Even a beginner can do I great job.
You shouldn’t have to work 10 and 14 hour days to make a decent living. The last minute doc deal cost me at least, that’s at least 1 to 2 signings a day.
Your running a business and there are a lot of expenses. Every time I see some guy say " see this little stamp it can make you a100 $ in as little as 1 hr… That is real bs.
Step back a look around people are making good money just working an 8 hour day.
I’m up every nite till 10 12 printing docs and scanning.
So John, most of us don’t “want” to drive 2 hours. Some of us “have” to because of this thing called “geography” by living in rural areas (such as myself). When they call with a $75.00 REFI that’s an hour away, and I counter with $250 followed by “look at the map”, 90% of the time they are calling me back with the $250.00 approved. Does this sound unique? It should, because the areas some of us live in are unique as well. You can’t pick nothing “close by” if there is nothing close by to pick from. And they don’t tell the borrow that they can’t have a mortgage because they live at an address that doesn’t come up on the GPS or they have to pay the notary $250.00. It’s this very concept in addition to those that didn’t want to make the trip (if any) is where my “clout” comes from. Again, as I stated before, location is a major factor in negotiating fees which is why fees can not be standardized, and never will be. Just like I tell the signing service I need more money, then they go back and tell title they need more money, and it works like that all the way back up the chain. At the end of the day, everyone gets there money so the borrower can get there mortgage. I was a signing agent in 3 different states (public info) and worked in all kinds of areas, from NYC to places you didn’t think could exist in WV, and everywhere else in between. Regardless, everyone gets their mortgage no matter what we get paid, because whether we get $75 or $250, it’s still peanuts to the bank when compared to everything else going in and out of the deal. I get $100 per hour whether I am on the road or at the table or I don’t leave the office, and I don’t see my office much. I don’t know, maybe people are trying to get away from the city life! It works for me because I make it work for me (with a little help from the deep woods).
Sorry for delay - was waiting for permission from the person (who is very reliable) who posted this to share it here - here is what was posted elsewhere -
From RESPA news:
"The current RESPA-induced settlement process creates competitive economic inefficiencies that raise the cost of mortgages for consumers.
The best solution is to create a competitive market where lenders benefit from low closing costs and are incentivized to drive the costs lower via all-encompassing closing packages, according to a new report by a Consumer Financial Protection Bureau taskforce.
Read on for details from the Taskforce on Federal Consumer Financial Law."
See Section 5 for area of concern, then Under Section 3.6 - Recommendations - Pg 19
"13. States should consider eliminating or streamlining licensing requirements for providers
of financial services to avoid anticompetitive barriers to entry. <<< Huh???
The Bureau should remove regulatory barriers to allow guaranteed prices on packages of
settlement services and mortgages to be made available to consumers. This exemption should be
allowed for lenders and mortgage originators that offer loans without upfront fees:
A guaranteed-price package that includes the cost of all loan origination charges and
other settlement services needed to close the loan;
A loan with an interest rate guarantee; and
A package price that remains the same throughout the mortgage application, approval,
and settlement process, subject only to changes related to final underwriting conditions."
First, where’s the weed killer ! As I see it, the listing of individual amounts gives the client a real understanding of their costs. They are always ADDED up for them on the CD. The BANKS, the Big Boys are pushing this…not the poor client who has NEVER or only seen 1 or 2 CD’s.
This is very intriguing and funny at the same time, considering as of December 1st, 2020, the federal government (Federal Housing Finance Agency (FHFA)) started charging a 0.05 percent fee ($500 for every $100k borrowed) on all refinance loans, which are the majority of our work due to the historical low rates. Have yet to see this fee explicitly lined out on an ALTA or CD as a line item, but rest assured the borrower is paying it.
I relocated from the 4th largest city in America to the Texas hill country with a much lower population density. My territory changed from a 15 mile radius to 2000 square miles. When offered $75 for a 180 page signing that’s 70 miles round trip from the office, and the offer states not to reply with a counter offer, I don’t reply. I’ll let competition lose money of these signings.
I’ve found that when SS is located in a much smaller state than Texas they don’t understand that two counties over often means 200, round trip, or more miles from the office. They really have no idea the size of Texas. We have counties the size of many States and zip codes the size of several counties.
As a result I have a tiered pricing structure that’s based on distance.
I include a premium for, weekends, package size, and the lender/title company. There are lenders and Title companies I no longer engage due to things like poor formatting of the documents leaving no room for my stamp and signature, package size, redundant notarial acts, the need to attach a lose certificate, and notary certificates not meeting Texas requirements. It takes time for me to clean up the package that the lender, title, or SS doesn’t want to for. Many of these low bid signings end up back in my in box, for my original bid, because the low ball notary botched the signing.
Right on, snaudain. I originally thought that $90.00 for a 125 page signing was adequate; $90 for one hour, great.
Reality- $90.00 for 1 hour signing, 1/2 hour for printing and sorting, 1/4 hour for checking that print came out correct, 1/4 hour for confirming date, time and place (sometimes 3 follow up phone calls)
1/4 hour for rechecking after signing, 1 hour driving to/from the signing, 1/4 hour dropping off docs at FEDEX, etc, (4 hours) cost of printing 125x2 @5cents per page=$12.50, gasoline use $2.50 (I drive a Prius), Hmmm let’s see, $90.00-$12.50-$2.50=$75.00 for 4 hours work= $18.75 per hour. I can go on from there, last minute cancellations resulting in turning down other offers, wear and tear on your car, rejects, coming back to get that missed check mark in the middle of the page, I coould go on but I’m trying to be positive.
Tell me it isn’t so.